Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You usually tell me.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You're lying.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We're here in Senate Transportation. We are here with treasurer Mike Peachlik, and we are here to talk about Vermont Green License Plate. Welcome.

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Well, Westman, thank you very much for having me. Thanks to the committee for the time as well. You know, I think I wanted to provide a little bit of an overview of this idea and some of the details around it as well. But just as a general framing, you know, this was something that we thought about over the summer and fall and something that we thought would be a really feel good piece of legislation this session in a year where there's gonna be a lot of, you know, challenging conversations and challenging topics to be had. So this proposal would create on the back plate, it wants license plate. There are a number of black plate license plates now. None of them connected to a sports team or the Vermont Green. But for those that may not be familiar, the Vermont Green is a football club based in Burlington. Are part of the USL League two, and they won the February this past year. They have driven a tremendous amount of excitement in and around the Chitney County and Vermont area. They have a tremendously loyal and strong fan base after just a number of years of operating. They have been really successful on the field, getting better and better, and having won the championship last year. They have a great connection with UVM. The hockey is their soccer as well for the players playing on both teams. And as you know, UVM won the national championship last year as well. But they also just are a great, in my opinion, community asset. They are something that a lot of people in Burlington look forward to participating in, to watching, to going live to the games. There are a lot of young people that go. It's kind of activity and a kind of an organization that provides vitality that's really critical to all of the things we're trying to accomplish in Vermont in terms of growing our economy and building more housing and building our workforce. These are the kind of things that you need to add to that kind of vitality that makes up a strong community. So, you know, the license plate proposal certainly would let residents show their support for the climate and also generate tens of thousands of dollars annually for a new special fund. The idea would be that this new special fund would be managed by a board out of the treasurer's office with the treasurer, the DMV commissioner, representative from the climate action office, and then a representative from the Vermont Green and the Outdoor Business Alliance. So the Vermont Green's mission, and you'll hear from the Vermont Green after me, but they have a strong mission in environmental sustainability, access to outdoor recreation. So the idea would be that these funds that were raised from the license plate partnership would go to the special fund for grants for those purposes, support environmental sustainability and resilience, and support Vermont's outdoor recreation economy. So, again, things that are mission aligned with the Vermont Green, but also things that are really critical to Vermont. You know, the idea around resiliency is something that is gonna be with us for quite some time, building a more resilient community, building more resilient communities in the rural parts of Vermont that have seen disproportionate impacts from climate change. Do we protect them from those climate disasters? And that's purely an economic issue certainly and also beyond just the economic issue in terms of people's homes and businesses being impacted and and washed away and that traumatic impact that has on people. But the other piece in outdoor recreation is one of the really bright spots in our economy. Be able to lean into that brings tourism dollars to Vermont, brings tourism dollars to rural parts of Vermont because a lot of the outdoor recreation opportunities are disproportionately in more rural areas. So I think it's clearly a a win for Vermont. You know, Vermont Green has built up a certain profile not just in Vermont, but regionally and nationally. It reflects a lot of Vermont's core values of fairness and community and commitment to doing what's right. The team's success has also been, as I mentioned, an enormous sense of pride for the community and for all Vermonters. The plates will allow Vermonters to show its pride and stand for those shared values, reinforcing the club as a place that is good for Vermont and a place where Vermont treats everybody fairly and with dignity. I think it's also a big win for the Vermont Green. You can certainly hear about that from them. But, you know, soccer and soccer in Vermont and soccer in this community is really one of the fastest growing sports. The energy and the excitement around it. The plates would help deepen the team's roots in Vermont, help expand its reach across the state, and help cement their role as a team for Vermont's future. So I think the benefits are felt for the state, for the team, and generally for Vermont and for the community. A couple of things here to mention on this concept of the fund, you know, this is new revenues without new taxes. The program creates new non tax revenue streams bringing in additional resources for, again, climate justice, outdoor recreation. On the climate justice front, we hit on that, but, you know, you know, this committee knows from your work as well as any how many natural disasters have been declared in Vermont the last fifteen years. How much FEMA funding has come to Vermont over the last fifteen years. All of the work that we need to do to make our communities more resilient. And this won't be a huge pot of money, but it will be something, and it will be something that is able to move forward this really important work. And then of course, the outdoor recreation piece as well. We have the second highest share of our GDP in the nation that's attributed to outdoor recreation economy. So it is a really critical place for us to lean into and invest into when we can. So on the next slide, there's a little bit of a visual. It's just a concept of what something would look like in terms of Vermont Green's license plate similar to the conservation license plate that you may see or building bright futures license plates that exist. And it would be the same concept that those funds go into the special fund managed by the treasurer's office and then used consistent with, you know, the the purpose of the fund and consistent with the Vermont Green values. We have other special funds that are set up similarly, not from this kind of revenue, but from other revenue where we manage it with a group of stakeholders, including the DMV around our municipal equipment loan fund. For example, we have our 10% Vermont fund as well where we do have outside of our office, outside of state advisors that advise us on what we should do. So mechanically, it's something that we're very familiar with running in our office. And then on the last slide, just a little bit of a bit of humor, but we were drive I was driving and had a stop sign or a stoplight, and I said, boy, you gotta take a photo of that really quickly. This is about two weeks ago because it looks like Vermonters are already creating their own Vermonter green license plate on their own. So I think there is a a calling and a demand for it. But in all seriousness, you'll hear from the green, but their fan base is quite extensive and and quite large. And like I said, quite committed to the team. And I do think you would see quite a bit of uptake of a plate if it were provided to them. And And obviously, green through their outreach and marketing would have an opportunity to reach a lot of people in their fan base that would be interested in this. The last thing I'll mention separate from this is we've been having ongoing conversations with the administration and with the DMV and the agency of transportation. And I know they have some additional ideas or proposals that they're working on. So we're gonna keep our line of communication open with them. But we wanted to come in and sort of present this idea and the reason behind it sort of in its totality.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Question from Andrew? Thank you. You mentioned it at the back plate? Yeah. Why would it be both?

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: You know, I think the I'm not sure. It could be both plates, certainly. But I I guess when I've seen the special plates, like, with conservation, I generally I have both plates.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And they're on both. But maybe that's Okay. Old plates. I don't know. I think they're both plates. Okay. Yeah. That's your right. And then I think we have special front plates. Right.

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Like Vermont like Montchrom. Yeah. And I don't know

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: if we have if that is not being linked to the contribution plates or I think they're both plates. At least that's what I Yeah.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: And the idea would be that

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: if it is both plates, then the idea it's both plates. I guess that it's Tyson, that plate is sort of differentiating it from, like, a a strong specialty plate. It's sort of something that is meant to be as it was

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: in the image. It would be its own plate. Kinda like the electric car that we have up there. And so I didn't get that last part. Did you say the governor does support this or we don't know either?

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: We they have some they have an alternative, you know, conversation that they've been having about sort of the the goals they have around license plates for this year. So we've just been an ongoing conversation with them. Okay. Yeah.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: One other question about the environment. Here you

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: said environmental justice. You said climate justice, but what what do you mean by that?

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Yeah. I think I think the most I think there are two opportunities there. I think most likely it would be resilience and sustainability type grants, but it could also be something that is focused on, you know, energy efficiency or, you know, sustainability from that standpoint. Okay. So I think, you know, either I think it'd be a broad definition, but I think those are the most likely uses of something like that. There's not gonna be significant grants. I mean Right. Know, some of the other license plates from what we understand are, you know, we're talking hundreds of thousands if you're doing really well in revenue. So

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Do know how many the other plates are issued?

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: I think it's a better question. Definitely.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You know, thing? Last question is who decides on the plate design? I think I saw an earlier tease of this idea that's just the the DMV commissioner would decide.

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Or I think that's probably right. I think they would have to get their right license, the, you know, the intellectual property from the Vermont Green. They'd have to enter into that. So I think the Green would certainly have to be okay with the design as well as be able to, you know, offer its intellectual property. So I think it would be a combination of the DMV commissioner and the license holder. I you know,

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: the whole group you put together.

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: They can do yeah. Well, when when we did the electric plate, we said that the legislature had a say. Right. Not not saying that has to be for this, but we'd just like to know who is going to make the decision. The

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: legislature wants to be involved in air mode. We do have somebody that wants to redesign the state flag too.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Oh, yeah. Sorry.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Did you hear me?

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, I I was just yeah. It's okay. Whichever When you spoke about the administration having your own ideas on a on a plate, you're talking plates in general. Yeah, not this way. Exactly.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Here's a couple of questions. I think it's a great idea and, all over the state, there's support for the team. There's support but people don't necessarily know the logo and I just think it's somewhere it should say FC on it or a Buffalo just because the logo could be really just generally Vermont green. I just think that should be part of the design just so that folks understand. But could folks I think it'd be nice when we have these plates that are, mission based to be able to, pay more if you want to because there are folks that would do that. Is that something that is possible?

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: I don't think so. It's a D and B question, but

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: certainly Okay.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You know, when you

[Aaron Frank (Town Manager, Colchester)]: have your vanity plate and

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: you're putting your registration, it could be another field I imagine that's sort

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: of Every everybody that has a specialty plate like that is important.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. Right. Then if you wanna pay even more, just because it might be $50. Yeah. Yeah. Because people might do that.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: 49 is cheaper than a bed. The UK, guess. Yeah.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So I'm supportive and yes, I'm going go forward on this. Because I think we and just looking at the one up there, the bottom line doesn't say Green Mountain State. It says electric vehicles. That might be some somewhere where you could actually put the name.

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: Right. Right. See what

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: you're saying.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That would

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: be good. Yeah. Just just just to be clear on what it is.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: This was a very

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: much a prototype just to

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: get the image, that would be much that would be a

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: much better clear way than that.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That's gonna be. Thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. I might also say to you, if there's a fund, I suspect there'll be way to contribute to the fund. That's true. Right now, there's no opportunity to contribute because there is no fund, but there will be some. And those special funds

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: are

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: often you know, they're always written with that idea in place that there's usually a source of funding going into the special fund, but then there's usually this language that says, and it can accept donations.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. Yeah. But so if there's no fund, there's no opportunity. And I think,

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: you know, the Green can speak for themselves, but you can imagine a world where not only is this license plate concept something that their fans are happy with, but it's knowing that they've responded to that and supporting their mission aligned work and that they have a role in administering

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Then that very well could

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: be to other additional support.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: One last question. Would these be the can you get around these would be state, especially on grants? Like, do you have the follow-up Vulcan five point o when you issue these grants, or is there a way not be able to pay for it? But I think it's

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: such a small grant. Yeah. Maybe it no matter we have a granting in place in our office. We have other kind of grants that we do. They're relatively small also. But I think this is pretty straightforward process for us. And we may already be able just to comply with what we already have in place. And I and now we would envision doing it like we do with our municipal loan fund or with our 10% Vermont fund. It's basically have a you pay us open RFP, and you sort of have the process twice a year before you issue an RFP, you know, once or twice a year to sort of solicit and then issue the grants of that process. So whatever the structure is, like, it'll be consistent with what You're you're not feeling it would

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: be administrative at all on

[Mike Pieciak (Vermont State Treasurer)]: your on your office? I don't think so. I mean, it'd be relatively it'd be relatively, limited additional work.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Good. I know people that will want one.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. Yeah. So we're gonna go to the Vermont community. Great. They're more actually athletes. Then we'll if we run out of time, we'll get point of daily interaction. Hello, everyone. Hi. Hi. Oh, yeah. Thank you all for that. I kind

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: of read what I wrote here, it just I'll be able

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: to speak to the CPP. Can you introduce yourself, maybe?

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: Yes. My name is Patrick Inferna. I'm a resident of South Burlington, cofounder of Monterey and FC. But, yeah, just thank you all for even the the ability to entertain this idea. I think this this quite the quite the honor for us. So, my name is Patrick Inferna. I'm a resident of South Burlington, cofounder of Monterey Football Club, a minor league, pre professional soccer team based in Burlington since 2022. I'm here to give some background on Montgreens FC, our mission, and why we would support any initiatives for potential future for Montgreens FC specialty license plates. Montgreens is on a mission to not only bring the highest level of men's and now women's soccer as well to the state of Vermont, but to build a culture that prioritizes environmental sustainability, consciousness and stewardship. The club believes that software can be a powerful catalyst for a more environmentally sustainable and socially just world. From the start, our goal in building this club from our branding and business practices was to be an authentic reflection of the community that we played in and a medium for community gathering and expression. For us, championing sustainability and promoting a respect and a love for the outdoors is crucial to that authenticity. We wanted the Green to look and feel and think and speak like Vermont and to unequivocally uphold the values of our state. We have always believed that bringing high level soccer to the state was not enough, and that building a lifestyle and identity around the game was our path to permanence in the state of Vermont and in our culture. With this identity in the forefront of our mission, we've had the pleasure and the privilege of incredible community support since before our first match in 2022. We've had success on the pitch, which really helps. We've posted winning seasons every year, and this club attracted the club has attracted local, national, and even international attention and and accolades. In just our four seasons, this club has been featured in the New York Times, BBC, the Guardian, ESPN, and numerous other outlets that have praised the rising prominence of Vermont soccer culture. We're proud to be a part of that soccer culture. We believe it's built in conjunction not just with our football club, but with the University of Vermont, men's and women's, all of the youth soccer that's happening. The youth participation is really robust in the state, and just a general outstanding enthusiasm for the sport of soccer in the state. In 2025, the team played a really miraculous undefeated season. We we won our first USL two national championship, beating out 144 other teams across the country. There was a million little pieces that propelled us to that title and that feat, but one thing that we were 100% certain played a role was our now famous within this community home field advantage. Every single playoff game was sold out, and most of them were sold out in a matter of seconds.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Most I know I heard.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: Quite a few problems.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. People that I know are quite mad

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: about it.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: Yeah. It was our first the playoffs were our first having a deal with people kinda mad at us when we're a growing, I think. But yeah. So the the and the final the estimated attendance, because we couldn't over share this, we put it at about 5,000, which means only about half of the people were actually taken in the stadium. The rest were lined up wherever they could catch a view, which is an interesting thing with the university trying to figure out how that all works. On August 2, on 08/2002, we we defeated Seattle Washington's Ballard FC in the USL two national championship. So seminal moment in the growth of our club and kind of what we consider to be a movement. The match was shown on WCAX channel three. We reached out to bars and restaurants. There was, you know, over a 100 that were showing it, and the match was the highest viewed USL League two final in the league's thirty year history by quite a margin. And, yeah, so lifting the trophy was a physical reward for all of this, but I think the bigger realization was just how that greater moment of just where we were sitting in kind of the conscious of the state and the was, like, really, that that was the that was kind of the bigger reward for us. So, yeah, when when treasurer, and his team approached us about the idea of Montgrain collaborating with the state of Vermont on official license plate, we were obviously energized to to give this our attention. We see this as an exciting opportunity for our mission, raising significant fund for organizations that promote outdoor recreation and environmental stewardship, but also gives Monterey the opportunity to show their pride in seeing that we hope will continue to represent the state, its people, its values at the national and international stage. With the World Cup coming to The United States this summer and the soccer session taking hold nationwide, but I think in really extra intense way in Vermont, I think there's no better time than maybe now to double down on the way the state is falling in love with the game, again, in a extra outstanding way. Yeah, that's that's the color on the club and where where we sit on this and and why this is so interesting to us. Yeah. Cool. Alright.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: It's pre professional. Do the players get paid? Or is it kinda like the preprofessional baseball? Yeah. So it's like you support them, but they don't get actual paycheck. Yeah.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: We house the players, and we, you know, support them getting here and all of that. But they actually this will be changing as the years go out of the NCAA, but at the moment, they couldn't collect a a wage from us.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Some of them are coming up.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: Yeah. It would it would end their eligibility. They are all

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: are they

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: all Pretty much all.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We had a couple, like, that were

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: former pros, and we've had, like, players that were still in high school before, but majority is is players currently in NCA.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Cool. Just a suggestion maybe, if you ever can do it, is to maybe have some matches around the state.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: I grew up in Castleton and Rutland County, and we've looked into obviously, Castleton University Stadium, which is quite nice, and even, you know, Applejack Stadium in Manchester is, like, a very cool it's actually, like, built in it looks like in, like, an English stadium. Okay. Like and so it's we've tried to, but this schedule it's such a compact season. Yeah. It's always like it's a bit tough with the scheduling, but it is something we hope to start doing, especially now that we've got a women's team and and just trying to, you know, bring this out more to the the state. And, you know, we we're currently looking into actually forming our own nonprofit that that we want to prioritize kind of expanding access to the game outside of Chitkin County because it really does change, like, you know, where I grew up in Rutland. The game people are very excited about soccer, but it's not quite the same yet. And we think there's a desire for that if people just have more access to it.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Great. I'm proud of our own. They're excited.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Of course. Of course.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: James, do you have any? We

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: have a very nice feel, but I can't say.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Reproval.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That's enough.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Any other questions? Go ahead.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, I don't have a question,

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: but I did wanna say thank you so much for the work

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: that you're doing because I think it's brought a lot of community and joy at a time when Vermonters are feeling pretty low with some of the national politics. So I really, really appreciate that. And I appreciate your support of Migrant Justice and other organizations at your games because I think it leads to a really diverse group of people coming in and enjoying soccer. So I just wanna say thank you for that and for lifting up women's sports through that as well because that game was one of my favorite to see young girls so excited to see women playing and just the joy of that. I think you're gonna see a ripple effect for years of young people playing soccer when we have had a dip in that kind of engagement. So I really appreciate this and I usually am not in favor of us doing any kind of specialty license plate. So if I ultimately don't support it, not because of the love of the game, but more of a sense of do we need another license plate? Yeah. But I I'm open minded to this.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Awesome. I appreciate that. Thank you. Definitely. Thank you. Thank you very much for. Thank you all. Can you do this in five minutes? Sure. I'll record No stuff you do takes longer than five minutes. Be very quick. Are you still work? No. We're gonna ask him. Yeah.

[Aaron Frank (Town Manager, Colchester)]: Alright. Good morning. For the record,

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: my name is Damian Leonard. I'm from the office of legislative council. I think you all have S234 in front of you. If you don't, it's pretty straightforward. There's two sections. The first section adds a new license plate section modeled on the conservation plants and building bright futures or conservation plates and building bright futures plates that we already have in the state. It allows light vehicles and trucks that are less than 26,000 pounds, so light and medium duty trucks, to get get the plates. The plates would cost an additional $45 per year, so it's an annual fee. Of that fee, the first year, it's split twenty three seventy seven between the transportation funds and the Vermont Green FC special funds. And then following years, it would be 16% to the transportation fund and 84% to the Vermont Green special fund. I created those percentages. I looked at the existing plates and then rounded up the dollar amounts based on the percentages and then figured out the percent there. So it's designed to provide as much money to the transportation fund as the other plates do or slightly more. How how much you

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: get out of for the refund?

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: If I could ask

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So 23% in the initial year, so it's about $10 in the first year and then 16% thereafter. So I think that's about 6 or $7.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And that's the same for the conservation points in the

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Based off of the conservation and bright futures plates, which are actually slightly different amounts, and I don't know how we got there. If you move forward with this, you'll, of course, wanna talk to DMV about their costs and so forth. I'm assuming

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Yeah.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. We're not gonna go over with this without and then taking a look at what other license plates, but altering this. Alright.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Yep. So the second section is the special fund. It's created in the office of the treasurer. It takes receipts from the license plates plus any gifts, grants, or contributions, or amounts appropriated by the general assembly. The treasurer would be able to seek and accept grants along with the board that's created in there, and the monies would be used to provide support for environmental justice and the outdoor recreation economy plus the administrative costs of administering the fund. And then the board would be the treasurer, the commissioner of DMV, director of the climate action office, a representative of the Vermont Green, and the executive director of the Vermont Outdoor Business Alliance or designee, and they would be able to oversee the fund and make expenditures for grants and so forth. And I think I covered all of the key points. Any questions?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Go

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: ahead. Thank you,

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: mister chair. Yeah. I have a

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: couple questions. I know you didn't say the effective date, but I feel like it would be good to have an earlier effective date.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: This July 1.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So it is oh, okay. But their season starts

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: You would have to it would be up to you to move the bill out and to work with DMV to make sure that they could actually start getting the plates from Department of Corrections. Plates need to be designed, etcetera.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. So it would have okay. I hear what you're saying. I feel like it would be appropriate for folks to buy it

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: day one. I mean, I guess that would be a nice bet. So that

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: brings me to my main question, which is are you is is the way this is drafted, the football club can basically sell them? Like, they could have no. So how would

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: It goes through the DMV when you register your car.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So you wouldn't be able to, like, get a form at a gate to get a license plate? You'd have to

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: You'd you'd have to go online to the DMV. Of course, the the football club could advertise that the plates are available and direct you to the DMV. Okay. But you'd have to go through the DMV the same way you would for conservation or building bright futures or if you're getting another specialty plate, like a badminton plate or something.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: You you get those to the DMV when you register. And then in order to keep this plate, you have to pay the additional fee each year or each registration cycle.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And if someone like, I guess my only concern would be, let's say we get, like, Vermont red starts let's say there's a southern Vermont soccer team that pops up that's a rivals or something. I don't know. Or a company is that opens up and has some kind of competition. Is it appropriate for the state to support a specific sports team? Like, does is New York does New York have you can get a New York Yankees versus a Mets versus a like, is that

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So it it depends state by state. In New York, you can get all the sports teams. Okay.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: The Well, I could see in Vermont. UBM last year won the national championship in soccer. So Yeah. Hockey. Right. Yeah.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: And in Massachusetts, there's a Red Sox plate that supports the Jimmy Fund. There are Patriots plates. I don't know what those funds go through. So a lot of other states do have sports team plates. It ultimately is a call for you, though, whether that's a policy you want Vermont to follow or not and how you want the funds generated by the plate to be used. So some states do use them to support a specific charity or cause that the team is supportive of. Other teams, it's just extra money flowing into the transportation fund.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. Thank you. Yeah. My my only concern was really do we as a state it feels like a little bit of, like, a stamp of approval. This is the team that we want, but it sounds like that's not uncommon in other states. There isn't like a

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, a I think there's a number of different ways that this could be handled. Yes. You know, they even brought up, you know, and I'm not suggesting anything, but I think we're gonna have to do a little bit of digging. The Vermont Strong License Board raised a lot of money as a front plate. You know, which one's better? Why would you choose one over the other? I think those are the start of what the questions are, but other states do multiple things. I think we're gonna have to look at this a little, and I think we've already heard the administration is probably gonna have a proposal also.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Ah.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Which brings

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: up to the issue that you raised. So I think I think, you know, what I'm hearing around the table is we're all in favor of this kind of, how it might come together in the end might change some.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. Thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Patrick, did you have?

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, it might be a question for DMV, but quickly, if I remember back years ago, we had that somebody came forward with a plate idea. They had to guarantee a certain amount of sales. Could you talk about that?

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So there there are, also plates that exist for service organizations and public safety organizations, and they have to have at least a 100 in state members. But we're talking about, like, police and fire protection, rescue squads, the National Guard, the VFW, the American Legion. And the way that those plates work is that there's a $21 special fee, and in it, what happens is the organization subsidizes the initial run of the plates, and then their members can get a plate to say I'm a member of the VFW. Okay. Or It's

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: not a of the National Guard. Be the place here.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Yeah. This is different. This is more like the conservation plates with the trout or the deer. I think

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I think of presentation from DMV about what they do all the way around and will help us think about this more. Yeah, go ahead.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And really, this is for the sponsors of the bill, but environmental justice, I if that's defined in statutes. We have the environmental justice law. I don't know if it's defined

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: in there.

[Damian Leonard (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: It's not defined for purposes of this bill. This the language for this bill was was modeled on a proposal from the treasurer, but you can certainly specify what environmental justice means or change the wording, to something that, you think is more appropriate or, is better defined. I

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: the sponsors might say to you that that this got introduced, that the drafting request came in from the treasurer's office just before our deadline. I bet you should.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Why? Moving. So

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: the I think the sponsors of this didn't get a whole lot of time to pivot somewhere.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Moving was only only two names. But

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I think from what I'm hearing, we all think it's a good idea to at least give the investigate this. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. We next is the agency of transportation. Thank you all for coming. Thank you. Thank you.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: think you're on

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Do you have a?

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: I do. We're all we got just a few slides. Bear with me.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I will say we've helped that on making soccer related topics. I don't know. Like, oh, this is a real I don't know. Since you're getting like, you're going to the goal. This is Oh,

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: fun. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We held that. That was good.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: So you didn't get punted?

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: No. We didn't punted. Yeah. They're looking.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Megan, do you have my slides? My my computer is not booting up.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: There. Uh-huh. Okay.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: And I would hate for you to navigate with 10 slides with me, but may have to ask for your forgiveness.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I think put that foot in the. Pass it around. Yeah. Yeah. Yes.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. He is a little nice.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I bought him now. Nice.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Oh, no. Are you guys? Are you?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Ross. I

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: think I need you now. Thank

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: you. Yeah.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And I'm I need to leave at eleven, so it's not I'm I'm just gonna quietly run out. But

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Sugar.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: They're very small. Yeah. There's another.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Where does some of this stuff get

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I didn't want you to eat so big that you'd fall asleep. Sure. That's itchy. That's crazy. That's fine.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You get in? I thought I just saw you.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: So no Internet. I

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, I can't read the 18th Street.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Your lunch. I know. This is what I'm saying. I'm trying to be a delicate eater.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I do.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: But Yeah. I live in the egg shop. I am. I

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: just like it. Yeah. But What I really like about that big shop is the little fire out in front Yeah. Have a little fire pit.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I haven't seen that. I know a lot of people just go to the hangout. Hey.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Again?

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: I'm coming in there. Just to share real quick.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. My grandmother used to do a slice of bread with a thick slab of butter and dip it in her coffee.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: I put

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: all that on.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: No. Okay. There you go. And we keep our butter out of the fridge. And

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: you want another little butter thing with the water or just

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Don't we not do that anymore?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That that was an effect

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: for us. It

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: doesn't work in. We

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: do it like a glass.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We'll start having

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: If you put your butter in the footage, I'll go. No. We don't have last one. We didn't see.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You should be able to share.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you. Thank you. Head's here.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. And Clayton's here too. I'll step away. Good. That's Works. Are you ready? It's possibly. Senator.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Thank you very much.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Nice.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Thanks for your patience. Ross McDonald, public training program manager, program for nineteen years, program manager for six. And today, let's talk about the O and D program. Surprisingly, nobody, it is the most challenging of the programs to manage due to the unpredictable demands that we receive from time to time every year and the way that we allow for regional flexibility. But this program really flows through the fund or applied through our annual grant transit grant with the longest fixed group capital admin needs. We look at the history of outlays, different dynamics, different trip types, and then we provide an initial award. We also withhold some dollars for midyear adjustments, understanding that we'll be right or wrong by big percentages. And we then work through the midyear adjustment to to right size the program, especially you can. Then the transit provider, to be current to that review, is establishing their regional planning with the Regional Planning Commission, their O and D or Mobility Committee meetings, look at the agenda, last year's budget, how close were they to budget, what were the trip types, what were the matches, all of those things, the non federal match. And they advise and contribute and support the budget and those tough decisions on these constraints. Each one of these regions have constraints in terms of trip types and trip numbers, and then we just keep looking at that actual as best we can. So

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And I had a question quick question.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. And Go ahead, Rebecca. So I just think it's real it's important, and I'm gonna have to leave before this this is finished, but the mobility committees, those are not easy to find, just generally. Find that.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Do they get people to be on it or find where they can

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: To even first know that they exist Yeah. And to know what their authorities are. They're really important committees. And for example, I found mine a few years ago, but I never hear anything from it. I don't know if those meetings are advertised.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: The RPC in that area, Colin Brennan, is the facilitator and the convener of the OMD committee in that area.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I completely believe that, and that makes sense, but I'm pretty attuned to transit and I never see that. When I tried to find one, I was able to, but I think it's important that the riders and the users and municipalities know about those or know more about those.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You think it's the member of the Senate from Windham County and on the Transportation Committee that you might have a little more access than the general public?

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Possibly, which is in fact,

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: anyway,

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: a former board member.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Right, but not of that committee. Those are challenging.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Where did the funds come from? What's what's prior to your first thoughts there? Like, are there

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: a mix of federal and state funds? They are. We use a mix of the FHWA Flex dollars, STPG, and CMEC dollars, And we now are pulling in carbon reduction program funds, which can be used like CMAC dollars. So that's that's the 80% funding that we use for the from the federal side of things. Okay.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So you just wanna Yes.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Is it

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: required? It is the 20% non federal match is required. Did the program require? No. The program is not required. The requirement is that we receive E and D, or elderly and disabled, funds to the tune of $310,000 a year. We usually buy vehicles with those dollars to support the operations of the program.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: But those are competitive grants?

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Is that That a formula. And then there will be some mobility management competitive grants from time to time that we've applied through for Gofer and other types of institutes. And so every year we look at what was the budget, what was the requested total from all of our providers, and what were we able to cover with our initial award. And with O and D, we saw the $6,100,000 request, that was far exceeding our expectations, and we cobbled together some capital, unspent dollars, some older o and d funds that were unspent, and we're able to get up to about $5,900,000, and it's still not enough. We're seeing these types of discussions like we're having in Colchester throughout the state. And so the time is now to to address some of these opportunities that we'll talk about. These are the trip details. I think you probably saw these a few weeks ago when Dan was here. We really do look at these as the critical care, medical needs, senior meals, adult day, wellness, shopping, essential shopping as as our priorities, the vocational, social, personal. Those are added on in layers that we understand are are critical to so many people, but that's those are the trip types that we look to provide. And when we look at the modes, volunteer drivers well over fifty percent pre COVID down to forty four percent. That pushes costs up. When we look at trip purpose, as a statewide program manager, you look at social, personal, vocational, 11% of the overall budget. That's probably, you know, a comfortable place for us to be and not seeing where social, personal, or are are taking all the non Medicaid medical or some or or similar. And it's all over the place. Each region has their own demands and adult day services and access to hospitals and health care. And I just highlighted the social, personal, and vocational to point out that certainly at GMT, urban, the social, personal, and vocational are far more important than they are in the other regions.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Just to go back one slide, well I guess you could also look here, but so for non Medicaid medical needs, would that be like picking up your prescriptions? Would that be an example of That

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: would be essential shopping. Been for those doctor's appointments and the physical therapy and the wellness and the sash type type of services where you have chair yoga and those things. They bring people into the senior centers for to participate in those types of wellness activities as well.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. Thank you for that clarification. So it would be considered critical

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: shop if if you were picking up some script. Yeah. Essential shop in the Village Hall. Correct. Okay.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I don't see it here, but we will wanna spend time on the initiative that we take some ownership in this committee about getting volunteers.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: I mean, I do have an update on that, on those efforts. Well, we'll want

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: to spend some time in that and figure, particularly with the idea that halfway through this fiscal year that, you know, will be if three of us are after new committee, and the Medicaid reductions that look like happened, the Joint Fiscal Committee got a report in the fall, and I think they said as many as 45,000 people could be losing their healthcare coverage. And with all of that and the pressure on communities to maintain services in my community, our hospital board voted to cut births at our hospital and services for particularly young mothers. Yes. We need to make sure that they at least have access to rides to wherever those services are. So we'll wanna we'll wanna spend some time to dig into where we are with that and where we've got to. Thank you, mister chair. And we'll be

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: talking about sec the section 28 report where we have been charged to work with the health care hospital system. Yep. Some good information there. I can bring some information on the section 24 reports that we've awarded. And so just moving on, you know, why are we talking about the O and E program a little differently now? Because that's where the money is, and that's where the cost increase have been. On average, demand response trip is $53. It was about $24 pre COVID. And so all of these costs are up significantly 60%, up around a 100% on demand response. And when you look at $53, that 53 is the average, and folks like at GMT Rural at, you know, just around $90. You can imagine where we didn't hear from Colchester and and the folks because they had the budget, and they didn't have those costs to allow for the trip types to to be maintained and sustained. We so as we know, GMT Rural is moving to RCT, which is in the rearview mirror, and partial leak, and TBT, which is coming up. So we hope that will reduce the costs and improve the services, allowing for more trips for more people. And here we are with the volunteer data. In July, when we when we first saw the t bill, we took an assessment. We've got a 170 full and part time volunteer drivers. We added two and a half staff members and are moving through some other grants that are part of mobility management, and we've added a few. And this is with some snowbirds too that come off the come off the system for the wintertime, and that's up to one ninety two. The goal is 300 by July. And everyone has received a portion of their $600,000 to hire coordinators, to help outreach, to develop branding plans, those things. And I'll be sharing a a full review of each provider and each activity and efforts that they're looking to to provide over the next few years. When we talk about volunteer data, I'm very appreciative of of the senate and and the investment. If last year was, let's build the volunteer and the community driver capacity, this year could be mobility management, where we really look to work with those folks who are on frequent long distance trips and see if we can find other ways to combine to bundle those types of services and to reduce some of those costs.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. We'll want you can't do it without drivers. And then when you get drivers, more drivers, we need to make sure they're as efficient as possible. We get all of that, and we'll want to look at this, you know, I particularly, and I'm going to say this just for me, when I'm looking at cuts in healthcare, this is an area where with reductions, the only way you can get people to services, particularly those that are most at risk, older and lower income, is provide them rides, and this is the most efficient way that we've got, particularly looking at reduction in services across the state.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Our program shares the concern. We sit on working groups with Department of Health, Dale, those folks in

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: there also concerned about those impacts that you spoke of I understand that, but we we knew from last year that the amount of volunteer drivers from before COVID to now was reduced.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Go ahead. Thank you. So, just so that we can have good conversations and look at alternatives, do you have GIS data for where the people are going and where they've gone like in the last two years? The

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: system Through the demand response program? Yes.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: I'd if we can get the OBs, origins, destinations, have some folks roll that information up.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay, that would be really helpful to know where they're coming from and where they're going to and how many.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Check that out.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That would be because there might be other ways that we can do this.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And you chart your number of full and part time drivers. That's part time full and part time volunteer drivers.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: That that's exactly. Just only volunteer drivers. And so I do it full time in the summer, but only part time when the weather suits them during the winter time, of course. But, you know, the challenges that we've reviewed, we know the cost increases are there. Fewer volunteer drivers, which this committee has addressed. The demand increases are real and significant as we age. The fastest growing age and demographic of those people are 80. Those are the folks who are, you know, aging out of driving. We did add social personal and more vocational trips as we looked to try to achieve a a more of a mobility for more options and reasons. And again, this was continuing to be a surprise to us and our providers. We'll be working through the British Columbia Public Transportation Association next week and coming up with a few working groups to work on budget as

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: well as the O and

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: D programs. Opportunities, the Community Driver Program, volunteer program we just talked about. We'll let those efforts continue and learn from those. Mobility management, we've talked a little bit about what we've been doing at Colchester and next steps there and what we can do around the state. As we look at underperforming routes or inefficient parts of performing routes, is there an opportunity to redirect those funds from the fixed bucket of services to the demand response services, especially as we talk about some Medicaid risks, increased local contributions. So many folks used a in kind drawdown of federal dollars because of those volunteer hours can be used to match federal dollars. So a $100 trip becomes a 120. They add in kind and they're able to draw the 100% from federal. All that to say, there could be a way for us to work with different program partners to see if we could increase local contribution, something that maybe Aaron would talk about next. And then we'll look at the program guidance with this VPJ folks and see what we can do better together. And really, that's the the part from from our perspective, and I know there's a lot of folks left here. So just gonna close with that, see if there's

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: questions. Okay. Go

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: ahead. We weren't able to fund the request by, what, $2,200,000. Right? Mhmm. Would that 200,000, would that have satisfied the needs in the OOD program?

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Well, because it's constrained, whether it's the number of trips that you can take or the types of trips you can take, it never satisfies the need entirely. But what's that expecting need? And and generally speaking, yes. We withheld about $350,000 from the OAB program when we made those initial awards, understanding some people would be heavy, some people would be on budget, and then we we've been doing that since Barbara 's been around my predecessor. And so this year, for Chinook County, was $2.15 federal and 50,000 additional state where Colchester's able to apply state dollars, where other folks are are asked not to apply state funds, but to use local dollars and area on agent dollars and partner dollars So for that as a result, working with Folkesester and GMC, it looks as though they do have a way forward to sustain their current level of constraints. And that's that's where we're working toward. Without sacrificing services? Without sacrificing sacrificing services based on the latest projections that we're seeing. $1,500 or something. And and I'll let Aaron speak to those impacts on Colchester, but I I think we have a way forward with certain new options for the for all the areas to consider.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Hate to point you along. We are not gonna get to schedule a bit Clayton if we're our schedule's really tight, but I wanna put you in the chair for, for five or ten minutes. And then, if we don't get finished, later in the week, Aaron, we we can put you on Zoom. But if you can, as I wanna be at the government, I recognize that you had to drive down here. Alright.

[Aaron Frank (Town Manager, Colchester)]: Chair Westman and and transportation committee, thank you very much for your time. Nice to hear from the statewide folks, and we can hear a little bit about what's going on in Rochester. So

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: if you can do a a five minute talk to us Sure. If if what if we can't get through in five minutes, it doesn't look like we could get through your slides. Right. So what we'll do is we'll have you on later in the week, and we can put you on Zoom so you can sit here and and but we totally appreciate you coming down there. So from a high level, talk to us about it. Then because we've got a national company that is doing something in Virginia. It's supposed to be on at eleven. Sorry.

[Aaron Frank (Town Manager, Colchester)]: I'll try to do it in three minutes and leave a couple further questions.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. And then we'll come back and we'll go through your presentation. We do later in the week.

[Aaron Frank (Town Manager, Colchester)]: Right. So shortly, this is a wonderful program that the State Agency of Transportation uses. Erin Perchlik, I'm just your town manager. Prior to town management, was in the transportation business, worked in urban transit for twenty years in three different states, and I actually did help operate this program in in other states. I have a few perspectives on it. Just as Ross pointed out, it's a very dynamic program. We didn't know that last year was, I think, a 160,000 over budget in Chitney County. Ross was able to work with us and and give some more money, but because you're over budget one year doesn't mean you will be the next because of dialysis and and cancer treatment and that kind of stuff. So we got halfway through the fiscal year and boom. We're spending double our appropriation. Very thankful to, again, B TRAN coming in and giving some more money. They solved about a third of the problem. We're all left with a significant problem on Green Mountain Transit initially had mandatory cutbacks, and then they have since made them voluntary. There was also a lack of notice that Colchester advocated very strongly for, and a couple times Green Mountain Transit granted the increased notice. So now we're really at the point where we're talking about trip purposes. The select board chair told me that I could present to the select board a method of funding. The overage, I think, for the work trips is about 34 and $35,000, and we've identified 32,005 that we could cover that still at differences between the suggested but incentivized new rules is social personal and Colchester has for quite some years offered three social personal trips per week. It's generous, but we've been able to do that and feel like the minimum we can deal with is one a week and we're willing to look for money to do that. But that's really where the challenge is now. So the current year challenge, B TRANS has helped substantially. And then I just want to say this program is very valued in our community. And Colchester is more like the rest of Vermont than Chittenden County from a transportation perspective. Think about Lake, it's in the middle, it's just like a mountain. You can't get around it. It's very difficult for a police, fire rescue, parks and rec, all these things. And so we're the third highest community, city, towns, that together in population in the state. And I think we're fifteenth or so in in land mass, but there's a lot to it. So we have transportation challenges. We don't fit the urban fixed route system. We receive some. We pay for it on the same basis of other members, but this program is very important to Colchester. Ross pointed out we have high ridership and high use, but it's what worked for us because we're not concentrated. As some of you know, Windham District was once our urban center. They decided to remove themselves about one hundred and one years ago, so we're left with a more spread out landmass. Three minutes?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you very much, and thank you for being accommodating. We're just a little over scheduled here. We heard a lot about this from the senator from Alright. And Megan will get ahold of you and will later in the week wanna go through your presentation. Alright. Thank you very much, mister chairman. Thank you. And some. So thank you. Thanks. No. Please. No. Keep talking. Don't. Don't, please. I don't have enough to continue without.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And the

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: so this person is next, but this person is Okay.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And then Watson? Machine. Machine. K.

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: LIFE. Reduce the laugh.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Mark, can you hear us?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: I can. Can you hear me?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yes. We can.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: Thank you

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: for A little background. We have been taking testimony from the states that are in the league on the NBUF and high mileage users in the states that are moving away from gas tax. We've had testimony from Hawaii, Oregon, Utah, and last week we had testimony from Virginia. So that prompted us to get ahold of you. And if you could introduce yourself and tell us how you fit and talk to us about what you're doing in your organization is doing in Virginia, that would be really helpful to us.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Sure. Happy to be here. First of all, thanks for the invitation. My name is Mark Deflin. I'm the chief sales officer of Emovus. Emovus is the technology and operations division of our parent company. Our parent company is called Abertis, A B E R T I S. Abertis is a Spanish company. They are concessionaire, meaning they own and operate toll roads around the world. They do that as a business. They make an investment in the infrastructure in exchange for right of way. And then for that investment, they get fifty, ninety nine year, thirty year leases or whatever to charge tolls on the road or the facility, and then that pays back their investment. In the interim, they have a nice cash flow stream that they usually pay to retirement funds and those sorts of things. It's a pretty low risk investment, and it pays a little better than a T bill or a traditional bond. So it's a nice vehicle for investors. Our business is primarily toll roads, toll road systems. If you think of EZ Pass in the Northeast or Sun Pass in Florida or Fast Track in California, do systems like that. When I say we do systems like that, we do all of the front end technology that you would see on the road, the cameras, the sensors, those things that classify and take pictures of license plates. We do all that on the side of the road. We also have the technology that reads the license plates, and then we also have the operations group. These are primarily humans, people answering phones, shipping transponders, sending out invoices, manually reviewing license plates, and that sort of thing. A logical extension of that tolling business is road user charging. There are some nuances and it's more than nuance. There are some major differences between obviously the policies and that sort of thing, but some of the technologies and certainly some of the services are similar. We have deployed road user charging system mileage based user fees, depending on you know your your verbiage there in in Oregon and Utah in Oklahoma under a pilot, and also, as you know, in Virginia under a full fledged operational system. Virginia is, I wouldn't say unique in The States because now we have Hawaii, but they are one of the few states that have actually gone to a formal charging system as a choice. It's still a choice for drivers in Virginia to sign up primarily their electric cars as an alternate way to pay the fees that they need to pay to the road. The key to the system is mileage reporting. How do you get the mileage? There are several ways. One way is simple manual reporting, where the driver, the owner of the vehicle on a monthly or even annual basis reports their miles and you take the difference between the two dates and you charge a fee based on the number of miles. Sometimes that fee is a flat fee up to a certain number of miles, and then it increments based on a variable fee. It depends on your policy and how you want to implement the system. The other ways are an onboard device, sometimes called an OBD onboard device. These plug into the vehicle and they can track mileage through the vehicle's information bus onboard, and this is the same, and that information is already there. The OBD just plugs into that. These OBDs are common in the insurance industry, so they're not unique to road user charging. We just use them for that. They are a bit expensive and they require the user to do something and to install it. Anytime you have to make get the user to cooperate, that can be a challenge sometimes. The other way is through the vehicle telematics. These are the system that already exists in the car. Certainly, the electric cars have these systems, and we can tap into those on a wireless basis with driver approval, and they sign the forms, and then we can access the mileage through that. That's kind of it in a nutshell. I'm happy to answer questions. I know one of your key questions is timing from get go, like you said, all right, I want to do something to when you can actually deploy it. We can talk about that. Obviously, that depends on the nature of the requirements and your own procurement guidelines. So I'll stop and see where you want to dive deeper or if you have any questions.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We do have a couple of questions, and I personally interested in the timing question. Go ahead.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you, Chair Westman, and thank you, Mr. Dufflin, for joining us today. Sure. My main question would be around the telematics piece that you got through there at the end. Do you think that there is a need or like a push needed policy wise to get companies who manufacture beams to move forward with those types of systems? Or do you see it kind of organically happening already in the marketplace?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: I've seen some organic development, but that data should belong to the driver. A lot of OEMs and manufacturers feel like it belongs to them. So, that's where the rub is, and then they want to charge you for it, which now the user has to pay a fee to get the data and pay a fee to drive, that can be a little bit over the top for people to handle. So, your point about does some policy or something need to be done? Yeah, it does need to be done. I think there are people in Washington working on this. Don't know where that stands though, or who the right people are that are supposed to be working on this. I will say road user charging in general is kind of on hold at a federal level. Government has other priorities apparently than worrying about mileage fees, even though the problem is getting worse every day. The problem, I mean, the funding for our infrastructure based on fuel taxes is, you know, the gap is getting wider all the time. I'm sure you know that.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well, you've hit exactly on the conversation of the day here, and appreciate your note that it would be a federal move. I think what I wish we could do on the state level is require any new vehicles manufactured after a certain date would make that infer would have the ability to us. But it sounds like I'll just have to find the right person. Maybe our congressional delegation would be helpful. So thank you.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Well, as an action, I can follow-up myself if you want and give you some people to talk to at least. Are you familiar with the MBUFA, the Mileage Based User Fee Association?

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: No. Mean, not.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: They're very tapped into DC. So I will at this call, I'll email you Barb Rhodes' information, and they do a really good job of staying on top of all things congressional Washington.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you. That would be very helpful.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And perhaps you could send it maybe to the chairs of the entire committee, just not the point of

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You've got Megan, and Megan will be back in touch with the account for that.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: So Okay. Sounds good.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So in designing systems, what what are we looking what are states looking at, and what's the timetable, knowing that you've already had a system set up so you are, your company is in the forefront with probably as much experience as any in building these systems, what's a calendar look like?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Sure. In the case of Virginia, notice to proceed in the fall to go live in the summer, you know, that was about nine months. But keep in mind, Virginia was a fully operational system, so there was more testing done. There was a campaign not done by us, but by Virginia, a marketing campaign and informational campaign to educate, and then some time to get people enrolled and into the system. So that was about nine months from notice to proceed. Prior to that, I guess there was about six months of RFP or draft RFP and a response and then a competition. So, of those can be shortened if you needed to. In the case of Oklahoma, we did a pilot project, so we were able to, I don't want to say shortcut, but accelerate some of the testing because it wasn't such a mission critical, and they wanted to get it up and running. They had some federal funding that they had to comply with timing wise. We got that up in three months. That system was up and running in three months, but that was only 500, actually about three eighty participants, and it was only a six month demonstration. In the case of Virginia, obviously, it's a fully operational system, and we're up to probably close to 40,000 participants now in Virginia that have signed up for, I think they call it Mileage Choice, Mileage Choice in Virginia.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: apologize again for being on my phone. It's freezing cold in Pittsburgh, and the Internet is down in our building, so I've found a place that I can get online.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Where are you from originally?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: You from you

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: are in Pittsburgh?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Yes.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. Yeah. I I and what's the temperature there?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: It's it was eleven this morning. 11 Fahrenheit.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You are colder than we are this morning by about 10 degrees. So I'll you a pass.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Well, I I skied at Stowe many years ago, and that was the coldest I've ever been. So that was

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We took testimony from Hawaii about two weeks ago,

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: and it was 11:00 in the morning here,

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: and it was 05:00 in the morning for her, and it there was a marked difference in the temperature.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: I can imagine.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: She was I can imagine. Do you any more questions from? This is helpful, and we do have other people to testify if you would like to continue to listen.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Sure. If you don't mind, I would. And please use us as a resource. Goal is to promote the industry. We feel like if this industry grows, we're going to grow with it. We've done a lot of good work in the industry. We have one gentleman, Scott Jacobs, who's a pure subject matter expert on all of these things. He could take you down a couple hours of very interesting anecdotes about what to do and what not to do and those sorts of things. Like I said, we want to promote the industry. Ultimately, it's competition, but we want to share what we know. So I appreciate the opportunity.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Perfect. Thank you. Thank you very much.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: All right.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Did you say that

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Rashini? Yes.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: And Jenny Roberts.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: How

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: are you?

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Alright, thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you very much. Thank you, Mara, very much. We I'm sure we're gonna have more questions.

[Mark Dufflin (Chief Sales Officer, Emovus)]: Anytime. Thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay. So Roshini and and Jenny. Hello. Hello. Can you help us walk through the guide? Absolutely.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: In fact we have a presentation, a slide deck. Is it okay and we can introduce ourselves as we present the slide deck? That okay with

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We'd like you to introduce yourself, give us a little background and then we'll go into the dots.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Okay, very good. Do you want to go ahead?

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Yeah, sure. Thank you all for having Roshini and I today. My name is Jenny Roberts with CDM Smith. I am our national road usage charge discipline lead. I have worked on RUC studies, pilots, and programs all over the country. I've been working and supporting the Eastern Transportation Coalition with their mileage based user fee efforts over the last eight years. I believe you've, Trish Hendren has spoken with you all a few times. I've also been working with Utah on their RUC program and supporting their, program management for the last four years as well. And most recently, I led Hawaii's, reduced discharge program implementation. And I heard you all talking about the weather there. Rashini and I luckily got to spend a week there last week and enjoy their wonderful weather before we came back to the cold.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We take testimony in the last two weeks from Hawaii, Oregon, Utah, and Virginia.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: That's what I've heard. Yeah. And I saw a couple of those over the last few weeks, so glad to be added to the mix. Roshini?

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Yes. So Roshini, I'm based in Bellevue, Washington. Nice weather here. I've worked like Jenny on a couple of rock toilets and implementations across The US. And over the past four years I've supported Vermont through its rock feasibility work and up through its 2024 transportation funding study and Jenny and I also worked on the development of the rock guide that we present today. We'll be sharing some practical insights that help agencies like Vermont especially given the stage you're in navigate rug planning and decision making as you contemplate implementation.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Perfect, thank you.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Okay with that do you want us to go ahead and walk through the guide?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yes please.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Yeah so what we plan

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: today In fact we were doing this because it was recommended to us by the other states.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Great. Very well and I believe Maureen Bock from Oregon you to our team okay so the way we all have organized this Jenny will have a look for the first part of the presentation she'll provide an overview of the rock guide and in the second half I'll focus on how states like Vermont preparing for a first rock program can use the guide and draw on some insights from Hawaii because we know we just you just heard from them and then we'll leave a few minutes for questions. It's just we know we just have thirty minutes so it won't be very detailed but we will try to hit on the points that are the most relevant for Vermont knowing that we have worked with your team for about four years. So with that Jenny I will go ahead.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: You want to share your slide deck.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: There we go.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Okay

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: I'll just move to the first slide. Go ahead Jenny.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Okay. Well, as you all are well aware, states are looking at viable alternatives to our motor fuel tax as a primary source of transportation revenue, and road usage charging is one of those viable long term options. But as more states were recognizing RUC as a potential replacement for the fuel tax, there were leaders that identified a need for a more comprehensive toolkit for states to use as they considered how to move forward with a road usage charge in their state. And so this RUC guide is really meant to help states evaluate the viable paths and identify practical strategies for implementing RUC across states and regions and provide a sustainable replacement for those declining fuel tax revenues. So the RUC guide was developed by the National Cooperative Highway Research Program or NCHRP, and it was informed by a committee of RUC experts from across the country that represented multiple different disciplines from both the public and private sectors. So I think you all know Oregon, Maureen was the chair of that NCHRP panel. AASHTO was represented, ACTRI, FHWA, several other DOTs and organizations as well. Really a broad panel that brought unique perspectives to the guide. CDM Smith was hired as the consultant to conduct the research and really develop the guide, which is a web based resource. So like a website, it's meant to be interactive, searchable, and multimedia and meant to be served, not read end to end like your traditional report. So the guide was developed based on our experience with studies, pilots, and programs from across the country. You can see, Rakeshini, if you'll go back to the map there, you can see here there's states in various stages of road usage charging. Most in The U. Research and planning stage. We have over a dozen states that have conducted some kind of road usage charge pilot. We also have four operational RUC programs. You all have heard, I think, from all of them now, And Vermont potentially on the path to become the fifth. So lots of great progress. And I would say, you know, the federal grant programs that supported a lot of these state efforts have been very valuable and the progress we've seen across the country. So you can see here there's a lot of different paths for implementing a road usage charge. The spider web is meant to look overwhelming because there's no one size fits all approach. And finding that right path in a given state really requires that extensive policy development, organizational capability building, and communication. So states really choose their legislative pathway based preferences. So we've seen some states that have gone directly to legislation with little to no study, like Utah and Virginia. States like Oregon had a legislatively directed pilot, which then led to their legislation for their small opt in rep program that has now been operational for over ten years. And then Vermont has chosen the path, the purple path you see here from that pre legislative pathway one of that feasibility study that Rashini mentioned to a potential post legislative pathway four, which is that small mandatory rep program. So during our research, we really identified the most REC projects and programs progress through these four distinct stages that you see here. And the research and planning is really all those activities that you conduct prior to passing any kind of legislation. That setup is really what begins the after you pass legislation and start to create the rec program before its launch. Ongoing operations, of course, is anything after the program launches, so your live operations. And transitioning and growing really runs parallel to the other stages and involves all the activities that relate to planning for the growth of your rep program, like we're seeing many states like Oregon, Utah, Virginia, and, Hawaii already looking to do. So this is also a very busy slide. The guide provides building blocks and resources for each of those four stages of development. Now there's 71 different building blocks across those four stages that really help inform the next steps and decisions. You can see here, if you look under each stage, that we have these categorized or grouped by different topics. Under setup, you can look at system design or you heard Emovus talk about the vendor procurement stage in Virginia. So we have these different building blocks related to these categories or topics that can really help you navigate to what your state is most interested in. It's not envisioned that states will begin with building block one and move sequentially all the way to 71. And you don't need to complete every building block on your rec journey. You can decide what you're most interested in and what you really need out of this resource. So it's important to note that this web resource is again meant to be a guide and not an in-depth or step by step manual. So when you click each of those building blocks I showed on the previous slide in the rep guide, you'll see a high level overview of about one to two pages for each building block that gives kind of a brief description of what it is, more details about that building block, its primary use. In this example, you can see here it's to pass enabling bill. And then best practices and valuable lessons learned from other states, which can be very beneficial to leverage. So as you all know, it takes many stakeholders to implement RUC, and the guide has a dedicated page for each of these key audiences you see here. So those lead RUC agencies or policymakers, communications professionals, and transportation professionals. So it's designed to get them each to the most relevant information and resources. But the primary audience that the guide is geared towards is those lead RUC agencies that are responsible for implementing the program. The other users can still find a lot of valuable resources. We have great communications collateral there and you know anything related to their specific roles in the rec research or implementation effort. So I'm going let Roshini kind of walk through the guide now from more of that like user perspective.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Thanks Jenny. So Jenny just introduced the four types of users in the rest of this walkthrough what we've chosen to do is to go a little bit deeper but with the lead agency perspective because that's how you have the most complete view of the guide and we chose not to go to the policymakers perspective because it's higher level and it's very useful because it helps policymakers position themselves as in their oversight role but the lead agency perspective is the one that gives you a more holistic view. So as part of this guide, users from the agencies are invited to begin with a self assessment designed to help them identify where they are currently on the RUC readiness spectrum. So the assessment is structured in three parts. What you see on the screen is part one. And this is about determining the agency's current stage. So is it research and planning, set up, ongoing operations or growth? There are three questions that the agencies go through. Is there existing legislation authorizing a RUC programme? That's the first question. In this case, when we simulated the Vermont part, we said yes because we know we are on the cusp of enabling legislation. The second question is do you have an operational rock program and obviously it's no for Vermont and are you looking to expand an existing rock program again it's no. So as you click on submit would have Vermont will be directed towards the setup phase where you see building blocks that relate to the setup phase. So there are 19 like from 19 to 46 building blocks so let me just go back that you can navigate through to understand how step by step what are the different steps that you would go through to set up the programme. Then part two is about reviewing key considerations for a series of diagnosis questions such as whether the agency has EV adoption goals so that would be a yes for Vermont, conducted a pilot that would be no and if the RUC lead agency had revenue collection powers. So with this it gives you a list of factors to take into consideration as you contemplate implementation. Then after that you have the final part of the assessment which is about identifying likely challenges and that would give you some strategies that you could consider to address them. Typically cost of administration challenges, data security and privacy protection, or whether there's a perception of a rural or urban divide. So these are issues that we've seen come up in pilots and programmes and there's a list of strategies that helped you consider what you would want to implement. So from all these questions, part one to part three, what you have is a comprehensive set of practical building blocks, communication resources and proven strategies that can help agencies like yours like in Vermont navigate common challenges. So as Jenny mentioned it's really intended to be a flexible guide not a manual it's not a step by step how to but it does give guidance to agencies and to other stakeholders and help helping them build institutional knowledge as they jump into the implementation process.

[Sen. Wendy Harrison (Clerk, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So this is a view of

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: what Vermont would see once they submit the self assessment that would put you in the setup stage. So we mentioned building blocks nineteen-forty six. It looks overwhelming. It sounds technical when you read the list because those activities focus primarily on the administrative and technical setup activities needed for a RUC programme. They span from analysing, authorising legislation to developing system and organisational design all the way for system launch. And the magnifying glass shows a few examples of building blocks that address system and operation needs. So concept of operations, system design documents or customer service requirements, standard operating procedures these are the things that agencies would usually have to go through in detail to set up their operations in order to support RUC. So this sequence here looks pretty technical. Much of it does involve standing up systems and structures that support RUC. One key point we really want to emphasize is that these stages also involve a lot of internal and external communications, training and change management which are very critical to building understanding with members of the public, other stakeholders, policymakers and for supporting the staff members that will be doing the actual job. So I'll move into more examples and use Hawaii as something that Vermont can relate to because we know that it's a Hawaii has implemented a model that has a lot of similarities with what Vermont is contemplating. So Hawaii, they were in the research and planning phase so they had building blocks that focused them on strong stakeholder outreach, regular communications, robust pilot system design because they a statewide pilot and then general research that informed the policy framework for its small scale EV focused program. So that allowed them to move from planning to policy enactment by leveraging all the research foundation. So similarly Vermont, because it has conducted a rock feasibility study and some other analysis in the past four years, As a comparison we just put a few things that we know Vermont has done right. There are a few research and planning building blocks from the guide several of which do not involve conducting a pilot but Vermont has completed a handful of these including economic forecasts, revenue modelling, evaluating the cost of implementation and drafting legislation. So these are things that set Vermont up for the setup phase very nicely. So I'm going to go into what Hawaii has done and how it has leveraged its building blocks to set up the program. So they have leveraged building blocks to communicate the rock choice design that we know Mindy covered last I mean two weeks ago when she presented to you all. So how to communicate the rock choice design clearly to EV drivers, how to coordinate closely with DMVs that have to manage the program and implement all the process changes and building blocks that help advance the full program design not just the technical elements and then finally how to anticipate practical launch needs including customer support and operations so that all the team and stakeholders could see what the 07/01/2025 launch would look like. So here these are just a few examples that we wanted to highlight on the types of technical outputs that Hawaii got by following those building blocks. Are core technical and administrative documents such as administrative rules, concept of operations that we mentioned and detailed business rules all important to stand up the programme. So these documents provide clarity on how the system should function, they outline roles and responsibilities and help ensure that the eventual implementation phase is grounded in well defined requirements and most importantly consistent with the policy intent. And then here we really wanted to highlight what's not that I guess emphasized in the way the building blocks are presented but communications that have to happen alongside the technical setup work. So we repeat what we said earlier though the setup seems to be focused on technical components implementing a RUC program is more than building the system it's really about setting up the whole organization making sure people inside and outside of the organization understand it accept it and know how to use it. So this guide really emphasizes the close coordination across agencies external stakeholders and how internal team members need clarity on their roles in order to support the program. So it really reinforces that RUC implementation is not just about building the system and doing the plumbing but ensuring that all the stakeholders follow along. And on the screen here these are just a few examples of the communication outputs that were produced. They were really customized to Hawaii so the building blocks do give guidance on what types what are the best practices and elements that need to be communicated but very importantly they were all customized to the state's local needs and to local sensitivities. So I'll move to this slide which looks overwhelming. This is really something that puts everything into perspective just to show you what the rock guide covers and how different states have chosen potentially different pathways. So, on the slide you know you can see just three states we know there's Virginia also but we wanted to detail the pioneer state Oregon how it ended up covering almost the full range of building blocks on its own just because it crafted the path for the other states that implemented afterwards. Utah did take a different route. It leveraged a lot of what Oregon did. It participated in Rock America research coalition. So Rock America is a coalition of 17 states on the West Coast. And they have conducted some pool research that Utah also participated in and so Utah learned a lot from the collective findings and leveraged these to get into their own setup. Hawaii combined both approaches they were also part of the Rock America research coalition and in addition to that they conducted their statewide pilot with a lot of outreach activities so each of those choices that those different states made set them on a slightly different pathway there's a logical sequence to moving from research and planning to set up to ongoing operations but it isn't a linear path as you might think. Sometimes states like Utah they go a little bit more directly into set up but do occasionally have to go back into research and planning in order to be able to improve their program. So despite these differences what we have noticed that there are certainly some clear commonalities. All three states had roughly two years from legislation to launch during the setup phase and all relied on multidisciplinary teams to move things forward. That's very important. So I'll just end with a key takeaway for Vermont. There's no one size fits all model. It's really a guide not a manual and certainly there are shared elements every state needs to work through but a lot of customization also because this is ultimately about implementing a new policy that external users meaning drivers have to embrace and internal users have to embrace also in order to support it efficiently And then the last thing the guide is it just kind of brings together some common steps but it's certainly not meant to be prescriptive. So with that I'll move to question time so that Jenny and I can field some questions you may have.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: It's a lot of information really quickly. And it

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: seems like it would be more useful to the agency than us at this point. But it's good to know it's all out there.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Well it is, I think also and I'm going say just because Michelle is here, it gives a guide whereby we can compare what this is to what we've done and be able to answer the question, because we're gonna get the public questions about why did you do it this And and I think we need to be able to, and a high level, able to communicate to people why we did stuff, certainly. And so I think this will be helpful in helping us think about that. Because if we can't answer those questions, people are not going to have faith that we covered our bases.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah, no, it's going be useful. I

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: don't see a lot of hands. That doesn't mean we aren't gonna have questions down the road. And what, is the plan will be to use this guide to help us understand where we are because we're just behind those four states. And the efforts here will be where are our next and what are we doing.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: this is not the last we're going to be in touch with.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Well, I think you all are doing exactly what the guide was intended You've to brought in all the right folks. You've brought in the states that have implemented and and proceeded you. And, you know, that's really how the guide came together as well was just learning from all the states that have researched, piloted, implemented to provide kind of that collective research into one place. But I think that's what you all have been doing over the last several weeks and hearing from everyone and really gaining those lessons learned and as you all try to move into the next phase for Vermont.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: I would also say that we're kind of at a crossroads in ourselves. We will do AMBUF and it's directed specifically at EVs and electric vehicles. But we, like many of these other states, are looking at revenue shortfalls along with the cost of transportation projects that have So the question will be how long will we be just with electric vehicles, particularly it's striking from Virginia's point of a point where they talk about the loss in revenue between 2017 and I think it was '33, how much of that is combustion engines? So the whole discussion, this will be helpful for us to be able to frame that conversation.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Yeah. You'll find the transition strategies particularly useful. It will give you a lot of perspective on what other states have contemplated in terms of moving their fleet progressively into RUC or MBUF as you call it.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Go ahead.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So on your homepage, which was like your main slide that we had that we had is the is the guide really the building blocks? That's kinda what the guide is.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: And maybe if if you want, I can share my screen really quick, Rashini.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We didn't have you. I didn't see your whole presentation.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. We only have we don't have it. Yeah. Yeah.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: So we so we have, like, it's a link to your home page, which I assume the

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Yeah. And we can put and I think the last slide in our deck brings you to the guide. So this is can you all see my screen? I'm sorry.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. Where do you go to get the guide from there?

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That is the

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: This is the guide. So when you get on

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. It's not

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: the website, and I think we can provide the the QR code is in our presentation, so you can click there. We can put the link in the chat maybe, Rashini.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That would

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: be really helpful. When I

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: get to this page, but then

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Ready to move your reps. Are

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: you working?

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Yeah. So I'm sorry.

[Patrick Inferna (Cofounder, Vermont Green FC)]: I But that's not the guide.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: That's a good that's a video on how to use the guide. Right?

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Well, that's the start of the guide. So, yes, how to use it. Rashini walked you through the self assessment. Yes. So that's one way you can navigate that is to walk through those. You can also go up here and go to the rec users. So we talked if you're a policymaker, maybe this page is more relevant to you and provides different resources focused on policymakers. And, of course, my Internet's not working. Mhmm. And then yeah. Here we go. So then there's some different tools for that are policy focused. So you can guide through it by user type if you want. There's also the stages that Rashini walked you through. So the setups if we were going to the setup stage that the self assessment would bring you to, that's where you would then find each of those different building blocks that you can then go to for more information on these specific ones. So let's just say, let's analyze the bill language. And then you would get that one pager on that specific building block if that's where you want to focus. And so there's different ways you can navigate through the guide. Like I said, you can do user types. You can do it by the stage you're in and navigate to each building block. There's several videos throughout the guide that help you with the various elements. This is kind of that communications collateral. So you can go here to look at go buys from states like Oregon, Utah, Washington. What are they using for some of their operations or transitioning and growing and things like that? So we can certainly put this link in in the chat, and you all can navigate through this however you, see fit. But, yeah, there's a lot of information there, and you can you can use it whatever, path suits you best.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you. Mhmm. Yep.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: I'll put that in there. Oh, you put it

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: in there. Sorry, Roshini. Yep.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Yeah. And please don't hesitate to follow-up with us if you have any questions. We know this guide has been set I mean has been put up after many of the states actually completed their work and we know the customer customization that goes into it so if you need more help navigating it or additional information just let us know we have been supporting a lot of these states. We definitely Including Vermont.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: We definitely will be in touch. Part of what my hope individually is that we can use the guide to help us understand how we move through the system in Vermont and what the next steps are going forward and what are the things I'm that we need to look sure we're going to get questions from the public as this all gets unrolled. Why did you do this? Why did you do that? And what were the other choices? It will be helpful for us to be able to move through those questions and Absolutely. Have a thoughtful But we'll be in touch.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: That sounds great.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Thank you. You both.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Very good.

[Roshini (CDM Smith RUC consultant)]: Thank you.

[Sen. Andrew Perchlik (Member, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Alright.

[Jenny Roberts (CDM Smith, National Road Usage Charge Discipline Lead)]: Bye bye.

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: Bye. At this point,

[Ross MacDonald (Public Transit Program Manager, VTrans)]: Logan,

[Sen. Richard Westman (Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: You're off the boat. You're off the boat. At least for at least at least for right now. And I think that we are done for the day. Okay. Thank you.

[Sen. Rebecca “Becca” White (Vice Chair, Senate Transportation Committee)]: See you tomorrow. Oh, well.