Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Good

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: afternoon, and welcome back to the Southern Government Operations Committee meeting of Wednesday, 02/18/2026. Our next item off for consideration is H516, which is the town of Essex chart of change. And I understand we have three people in the waiting room, so we're there. We'll let them in. They're in.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Just a sec.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Can't see these numbers. There we go.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Now I'm hoping Essex is easier than Burlington.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: It's all working. So I'm sure they share that sentiment. Oh, yeah. Oh, good. We've got, three. Wow. So I see, screens are sold. Maybe I should get larger glasses. Anyway, there's I have one, two, three, four, five witnesses, and I see three of them up there. One of them is the sponsor who I don't see in the room. Oh, is. Oh, there you are. Yes. Good afternoon. Sorry, I just

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: had to step committee out to do that.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: So, we did already walk through this, and, Tucker Anderson has already, unfortunately had to leave. I think he went up to the gov gov ops committee in the house. I think that's what he said. But anyway, I know that senator Vyhovsky had some questions about some of the provisions in five one six. So I'm gonna let her sort of drive the bus here as we go through this again. And, hopefully we could come to a resolution and move this along for the fine folks in the town of pesticides. Yeah. I mean, my first

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: question is really just getting a sense of what what the intent of the leg yeah. I generally try to get an understanding of what it is you're trying to do and why. What problem are you trying to solve? And but maybe it makes the most sense for the sponsor go and then the town can walk us through the process and the Charter Commission member.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: And when you testify, can you just identify yourself for the record?

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Yes, hi. Good afternoon, Leonora Dodge, representative for Chittenden 23, which is a lot of Essex Town. And this came about after we had some ballot items to update some wording in our charter and also to switch sort of how to choose, for instance, like the cemetery commissioner. And, you know, mostly I'm doing the bidding of our wonderful town charter committee and following the recommendations of managers and select board. So this feels like it sort of came off without a hitch on the House side, gov ops on the House side, and was recognized as something that could, you know, that the changes were, consistent you know, with sort of public benefit, public good and public safety and good governance. So apologize, I I don't have more to really, really say about major problems being solved, but those probably better answered by the folks from the town directly who have done all of the great legwork.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Can you, I don't know if

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: we ever got the vote totals. Can you let us know what the vote in the town was and what the floor vote was as well in the house?

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: I don't have that in front of me, so I'll defer to Greg if Greg has it. And I do know that we did submit that on the house side, but I'll let Greg, you you're nodding, so I'm gonna let you go ahead if that's okay. I'm gonna defer to Greg. Yeah, thank you.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Okay, thank you. Greg

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Duggan, town manager for Essex. I don't actually have the vote coming out

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: of the house or of house gov ops. I do have the results of the vote for the town of Essex back in 2024 at town meeting. Happy to run through those. It would be helpful if I just gave some additional background first.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Was it 2025, maybe?

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: '20, excuse me, 2025. You're correct. Yes. Sorry about that.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Would have dealt with that last year

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: or in April.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: If you could give us the the votes almost, for the town, and then we'll get the other ones. If it was a voice vote, obviously, there's no way to know unless it was unanimous.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Article four, this was shall the town of Essex amend its charter to provide a clearer description of the role of the town moderator? Yes, nine zero nine, no, 74, 24 blanks. Shall the town of Essex amend its charter to change the timing of approval of select board minutes? Yes, seven fifty eight, no, 183, blank, 66. Shall the town of Essex amend its charter to change the appointments made by the select board and the town manager? Yes, seven twenty. No, two zero eight, blank, 79. Should the town of Essex amend its charter to require a mailed notice to residents regarding the availability of the town auditor's report and annual report? Yes, 675. No, 286, blank 46. Shall the town of Essex amend its charter to amend subchapter 10, Department of Real Estate Appraisal? Yes, 696. No, 224, blank, 87. So the Town of Essex amend its charter to remove the description of transacting business for annual town meeting that is now voted on by Australian ballot. Yes, six fifty nine. No, two seventy four, blank, 74. And lastly, show the Town of Essex amend its charter for de minimis changes that include wording, formatting, and spelling. Yes, July. No, 150. Blank, 64.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: What? How could they just Brian,

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: do you know what the turnout was, the percentage of eligible voters that voted in March 2025?

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: I don't have that exact number in front

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: of me. To make a reasonable guess, it looks like there was probably about 1,100 people voted. Essex has roughly 4,000 registered voters, so probably in the 20% to 25% range. I'd say it was a pretty standard turnout for town meeting.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Unfortunately, we've seen town meetings with, like, 5% turnout. I'd actually say you're doing alright comparatively.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: I

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: could actually, I take that back.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Don't hold me to that 4,000 number. I'd have to double check on that.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Did you have specific questions about any of the provisions that we I mean,

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I know a good portion of it is really kind of cleanup language. And so I don't really have any questions about any of the housekeeping language with the exception of all of the instances where you indicated that if you don't have charter items, then the law the state law applies, which is assumed. And, generally, we have tried to encourage towns not to do that in their charter. But the substantive pieces, would love to get the the background and and intent. And then maybe I have additional questions. Okay.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Sure. So just some brief history. Around the time

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: that Essex and Essex Junction were separating, the Select Board had been hearing from residents about some potential charter changes that they would like to see. So at the time, this is probably back 2022 timeframe, maybe 2023, I'm a little off on my details. The select board convened, created a charter review committee. They were tasked with reviewing the charter and making some adjustments. The Select Board had heard a few different things around that time about recall of select board members, a few other things. The Charter Review Committee did comprehensive deep dive into the charter when it

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: was

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: going up to vote at town meeting. I think it would have been 2023. The select board felt like they had time to review five of the proposals from the Charter Review Committee. So those went before voters, I believe it was 2023. Four out of the five of those were ultimately, all five were passed by the voters, four of the five were passed by the legislature. The one that was not passed was about housing. Just just cause cause eviction. Thank you. The select board sort of promised residents in the Charter Review Committee that they would revisit the rest of the Charter Review Committee's recommendations at a later date. That's what this is. That's what went before voters last year. So it was everything from general cleanup to trying to address some issues that had been identified by staff, by the Charter Review Committee that had come up here and there throughout the past number of years. So to get into some more specifics about that, so the town of Essex amended its charter to provide a clear description of the role of town moderator. This happened would have been either 2022 or 2023, the town took a floor vote at town meeting to conduct all future business by Australian ballot. That that was approved on the floor of town meeting. Because of that, the town the the moderator didn't really have that formal role of running town meeting. So some adjustments were made to the charter just to specify the difference between an elected select board member kinda having higher criteria about attendance, you know, running meetings, stuff like that, as opposed to the moderator, which is now really just kind of a figurehead position. We still elect a moderator. We still use that person to oversee and run the informational town meeting, but the charter changes were sort of to get acknowledged that the role of the moderator has changed. Please feel free to jump in with questions at any point. I'm just gonna try to go through point by point. Should the town of Essex amend its charter to change the timing of approval of select board minutes? The charter currently says that the select board shall approve minutes at the next meeting. That just has not always proven possible. We we still are complying with open meeting law. Draft minutes are posted within five days. It's not about that. This is the town of Essex purge charter approves minutes, but there's times where we'll have, like, a workshop on a Saturday followed by a meeting the immediate next Monday. There's no time to get minutes together, never mind, get them in the packet. So we were finding ourselves in violation of our own charter by not being able to approve minutes at the next meeting. So the the recommended change is to do so at the next as soon as reasonably possible to have the minutes approved. So that's trying to address a small problem. Amend the appointments made by the select board and the town manager. I believe this was largely the charter review committee. We do have a member here, Mr. Post, who can probably speak to that, but it's basically just trying to identify, actually staff had pulled it up as well. There's language in the charter that says the select board, the town manager shall appoint with select board approval to follow, and it lists a number of positions. So the Charter Review Committee added fire chief to that list, I think to have some additional oversight and public input into the appointment of that position. It removed stuff like fence viewers, listers, positions that we just don't have anymore. I think Representative Dodge mentioned cemetery commissioners that currently is appointed by the manager. Proposal is to have that appointed by the select board, cemetery commissioners, just like any other volunteer boards and committees. So less of a problem or just a clarification. The next one, shall the town of Essex amend its charter to require a mailed notice to residents regarding the availability of the town auditor's report and annual report? The way the language is currently written in the charters, we've interpreted that legal guidance has interpreted that to mean that we need to mail the annual report to every household in Essex. Costs about 10

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Brian, we have one question from Senator

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Clarkson. Sure.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I believe you were just on section two zero eight on page six about the appointments that are made by the select board.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Okay. I can pull that up. I wasn't not looking at the actual

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: document. Other there another section? Keeps going through the different articles as they were on the ballot. Oh. Which is now yes.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Correct.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: So sorry. That's hard for us because we have a bill, and it's by what's

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: in the bill. But, yes, it is section eight.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: It is section two zero eight. And the question I have for you, it doesn't list any of the things you just mentioned except the cemetery commission. So it doesn't it doesn't require it So that's It doesn't work.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: It

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: doesn't. Where? So on page eight, beginning online, that

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: not Okay. So we're further along. I'm sorry. No. It's okay. It just makes sense. And if you're gonna have appointments, you have them all in one place. Oh, yes. I do.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: But if that's not how it's organized in the chart No. That's not how

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: bill. Sorry. Sorry. We're just trying to follow you, and it was hard because it wasn't the bill. It was the balance. Sorry.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Understood. I'm yep. Apologies.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: I was running through the the ballot that went before voters, but I I will

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: We don't have and

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: I I will look through the the language of H1 of H516.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: If you don't mind, that would be just helpful so that we could follow you. We can't follow you because we don't have the ballot.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Right, absolutely. So let me get caught up. I'm going to scroll to the top and start over as much as I need to.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: You basically just did section two zero eight on page six.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Right. Hours of the town, section two zero four. That's general cleanup.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I think you're fine until we get to the two zero nine, the jurisdiction over other officers or employer. That's sort of where we were, I think. That's I'm page six at the bottom sorry.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: What what was that?

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: So that's the part that Senator Clarkson is on is page six, beginning on line 13.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: It it just follows the appointment. And this is

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: sort of general cleanup. It sort of looks like all that it does is add that line about that Vermont state law applies. Exactly.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Right. Two zero nine is general cleanup. Two zero ten is cleanup.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Section

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: four zero two, that's what I was referencing as far as the appointments by the manager. You'll see that cemetery commissioners has been struck from line 13 in section four zero two. That had been moved up to the previous section about appointments by the select board. It was also including the removal of grand juror, fire wardens, fence viewers, inspector of lumber and shingles, and the addition of, if the select board hasn't filled that position, the manager can fill that position within after forty five days.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Actions five zero one-

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: does still have to be approved by the select board or is that a unilateral decision?

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: The way we've interpreted it is that it will be the manager's decision. It gives the select board an opportunity to act. If they can't, don't, for whatever reason, then it becomes the manager's appointment. Speaking for myself, but not for any future managers, I would use some judgment and discretion. Would it have been forty five days had we had a meeting forty days? Yeah, I would bring it back to the select board. But I think it is open for interpretation.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I think Bruce has a question. If you could identify yourself.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Yeah, hi, my name's Bruce Post. I was on the, Charter Review Commission the first time in 2022 and chair when we prepared this document. Greg's, summary so far has been pretty good. I think on this section four zero two, officials appointed by manager, that was some language that I think we may have cleaned up earlier. There was some confusing language in there and we tried to make it a little straight forward and also give the select board a role in approval. And some of our members felt very strongly about that. So that's just for that section. And yeah, the confusion was the select board will appoint a development review board, cemetery commission and the town manager. And then several sections later, we have this division of what the town manager could do. So I think Greg has cleared that up for now. And, I can answer other things later. Thank you. Yep.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Section 501, general cleanup. Section 602, this was a bit

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: of a change. Starting to say that the current charter, basically the way we interpret it, we have to mail the annual report to all households in Essex. That costs about $10,000 $11,000 We've talked in the past about, would it be possible to just send a postcard mailer, letting people know that the annual report's available, the audit is available. This doesn't say we're going to do that, but it gives that flexibility. We would still have the annual report, still make it available, still print it. But rather than printing out however many thousands of copies and mailing it, part of the issue is that anecdotally, we would find plenty of reports just in the recycling bin at the post office. So it seemed like a waste. This is an effort to be a bit more cost effective and cut down on our waste while still making the report available to anybody who wants it.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Senator Vyhovsky?

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I really appreciate that, and I imagine that a lot of those reports that you send to households promptly, go into the recycling bin. But, in an instance where a household wanted a copy, was unable to get to the offices, I imagine you would and could still mail it to them. Okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Yep.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: They would have the opportunity to make that request, say, you know what? Can you send me a copy?

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Correct.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Okay, thanks. Seems pretty simple. So,

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: oops. Everybody, we've gotten picked out

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: at the pharmacy or grocery store. Well, was

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: on the Essex Charter. They do. And they do. I get that annual report. I do not throw it directly in my recycling bin. I can, in fact, look at it, read it.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: We just won the LCT awarded us one

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: of the best annual reports, so glad to know that's being read, McCadan. Time of holding. This was I'd mentioned how by floor vote a few years ago, everyone, there was a town meeting vote to conduct all business by Australian ballot. So this is just catching up with that change.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Seven zero two is cleanup.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Eight zero two is cleanup. Section nine zero one is cleanup. Sub chapter 10, that's changing the Department of Real Estate Appraisal to Department of Assessment. This is largely based on feedback from our town assessor, really just trying to capture the name of the department that it is. So I would classify it as cleanup. Same with section 103 or excuse me, ten oh three and ten oh five and sections 11 o one and the rest are just general cleanup.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Tanya Vyhovsky.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: So the one section I think we missed in that confusion is the section ending with the content around incapacity and removal from

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: office. What page is that?

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I'm trying to find it. I don't know exactly where it is, but I don't think we

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: covered that. See. Hold on. It

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: is there. Hold on. I'll just think it's page three.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Page three.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Yes. Line

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: 14 on page three.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: That is where I first see it. Yeah. So yeah. Exactly. Line 14 on I mean, the whole section starts on line five and removes some language and does some cleanup stuff, but I'm just wondering if you can if someone, you or or Bruce, can walk us through that.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I don't have those pages. I can go from page two to page five. Okay. No wonder I no. Yep.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: It's on page four. And it's on my door. You're going. Okay. Alright. I'll get inside. I have

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: your shirt off his back. Any

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Greg, are you the right person to walk us through those changes?

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Yeah, sorry. I was going to

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: see if there were more questions coming in. Yeah, so that's really, if you look at section, excuse me, line five and six, it talks about in the event of death, resignation, change of residence or incapacity. We wanted to define what incapacity meant. So that line is added there, incapacity shall include failure to attend at least 50% of the meetings in any given calendar year. So it's really just trying to provide some clarity about what incapacity means.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Thank you.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Any other questions for either Greg or Bruce? Yeah, I have one. Okay. It was the 50 I had 50% somewhere. 50% of the meetings?

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: It's at the capacity. Yeah.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Was the same question.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Yeah. So on line 14, it defines incapacity shall include the failure page for incapacity shall include the failure by any member of the select board to attend at least 50% of the meetings of the select board in any calendar year.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I'm just curious how they came up with the the the fifth deed. I would hope that they would does that not include if they I think legally, of state in the statute says that you can participate by Zoom, right, in a meeting? Yeah. Kind of

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: that means you're present. If you're on Zoom, you're present.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: We would consider Zoom to be present.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Okay. So 50%. So 50% seems low to me. Why?

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: It does seem low.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I was curious how they came up with 50 Can

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I tag on to that question? Did you base that on other towns, charters, other recommendation from VLCT? What did you base that 50%?

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Actually, I apologize. I misspoke a

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: little bit earlier, and I do see that Bruce has his hand up. That was more of just a cleanup. It does talk about, you see a lines nine, ten, 11 strike through. So the 50% capacity, excuse me, 50% for a select board attendance had been in the Essex Town charter. The select board had talked about if that is too low at a certain point and what expectation to have for volunteer boards and committees. But in the sense, it is just a rearranging, just a cleanup of the of the charter. But I might ask you to I would ask you to ask the, chair of the charter review committee as well, who might have more insight than I do. Bruce?

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Well, yeah. I tried to check up on a lot of this stuff and let's just save history. And I lost our interconnection a few days ago because of a billing snafu with Comcast. I won't go through it. It's a dastardly thing. So I'm hitching onto the account of our neighbors across the street with their permission, with their permission. I know we went back and forth on this, and I can't quite frankly remember. I also think our town attorney weighed in as well. And we were just also, I don't know if there's a statement of it in law, but we were comfortable with this. Having been on a select board, I don't think 50% is a low number. If you're missing half the meetings, you're missing a heck of a lot of stuff. So I have no problem with that. I mean, you know, and also it could be other reasons, you know. I don't know what your reasons are for missing a meeting. It could be health and things like that. But if you're not a participating member of the board, I think the board suffers and so do the people of the town. And I would also just like to go back and say that this is more of a cleanup. You can't believe how long it took to We clean were going back and forth with side by side drafts and comments. And our clerk was really great with spreadsheets and things. And it was very difficult to read at time. But we did have a big charter amendment exercise starting in 2022. The committee was appointed. We went through tons of stuff and we came up with some meaty changes. Adding a development review board, for instance. We were the only town in Chittenden County that didn't have a development review board. We did that. We did some other things. And then we left a lot on the cutting room floor. We had a very organized charter review committee and very enthusiastic. We met two hours every week or so for about ten weeks. It was arduous, and we put a lot into it. So the select board left some things on the cutting room floor. And this is what we try to do in this case, is just follow-up. And I think Greg has given a very good summary of what we did. That was our process. And here we are.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Questions, committee? Do you have zoning in Essex? I know it's off the wall question. Of course. Okay. Oh, wow.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Is the zoning matter anymore at the local level?

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Yeah. Oh. And then

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: it's not. If you want an exempt from Act two fifty as we go forward, yes, does. Just like watering sewer.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: You know, so yes, we have zoning and had it for quite a while. Can't, there are a lot of towns in Vermont, largely smaller, that don't have it.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: We don't have it in Rutland Town. That

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: is a problem.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: We're fully zoned. You know? We're fully zoned.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Well, we appreciate your

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Why would you ask that? Why would you ask that question?

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Well, I'm in another committee in the morning that has to and I don't know whether it was Essex. I think it was It is. The Docks. Supreme Court decision not The

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Docks. He's talking about the cannabis of the

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: dock. Yeah.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Cannabis docks. But that that's at the junction, not Essex Town. Yeah. Oh.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Yes. We are no longer Siamese twins. We're separated and not for, it was a decision the village made and the town was frozen out. Those of us who live outside the village never had a chance, but that's neither here nor there. Both gone our separate ways successfully with enthusiasm and things like that.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: And reinfection for each other, I'm sure.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I wonder what the alimony is.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I'm glad.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I'm glad that you

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: should dive into this. Sorry to have be flashbacks.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Yeah, please, please. You know, I have tried to explain this. We have a daughter that lives in Germany. We've had Germans come over here and stay with us. And I tried to explain to them the difference between the town village and the debate and they just go blank, you know. So I don't think we'll get into that here.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Well, didn't just get into it, but maybe we now get

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: asked. Yes, representative.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Hi. I wanted to just I think that the 50% attendance rate, if I recall correctly, there was sort of a thought around, wasn't there like a lot of back and forth about whether it would require like calling a new election? And, you know, they were weighing a lot of pros and cons of setting just the right threshold for what would be sort of truly incapacity versus versus taking away the voters, Like, you wanted to honor what the voters had had that an election that an elected official had been put into this role. And so I think that there was an attempt to weigh that voice versus the task of having to call a new election versus are the townspeople being served, know, to what degree are they being represented or not represented? And so weighing all of those pros and cons, they kind of landed it. If the person is there for the majority of the time, then, you know, they can't be, you know, impeached. Okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Any other questions, committee? No. This seems reasonable to take straightforward. Senator Vyhovsky here.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I think I am. I Craig, would it be possible for you to send the vote numbers on the different ballot items to the committee Sure. By email? I tried to track them down while you were talking, and about halfway through, I realized I couldn't keep up.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Who reported the bill from the house? No, Leonor is not on the committee.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Who reported your bill?

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Leonor, who reported the bill from?

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: It's a little confusing because there had to be an amendment, but I think it was rep Sandy is it Tebow?

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Was rep Pinsoneau

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: He's Oh, yes.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Was she the new Rutlander rep? Yeah.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Who's who's like a town clerk She's extraordinaire. Right?

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: South Rutlander. Rutlander.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Mhmm. No. Of course. Of course. And her son. Just the She's not. Believe.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: But she was the bill reporter.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Okay. So we could get a lot of

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: the details from her. She probably has some break some committee vote and floor vote. Okay. Yes.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: If there are any more questions, we'll let you guys go back to work

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: or wherever you go.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Can guys send those

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: for us? We're happy to see the State House looking so sunny and spring like

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Yeah. It must be cold outside. Yeah.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Well, it's certainly nicer to appear this way when at the Capitol at my back rather than driving to Montpelier when you're in session and trying to find a parking spot. Yeah. When I discovered we could have this solution by hooking up to my neighbors, I was all for it. I would also like to say Cape Tau to Lynn, your committee assistant. We both discovered we're both of Lithuanian heritage and both raised in the same part of Connecticut whose parents lived in, you know, Lithuanian ghettos. I'm a little older, but I'll have to meet you in person, Lynn, and we can trade stories.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Yeah, that would be worth the part of the spot. Thanks, Bryce,

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Did you pop off mute to add something?

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: No. Oh.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: If I if I send the results to Lynn, will that work? Will that suffice

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: to That's perfect. Yeah. That's perfect. And, Bruce, your background just serves to remind you that we have your back.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Oh, yes. Well,

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: I'll try is this meeting recorded? I'd like to keep that.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Yes. It's live streaming right now. We just live our life.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: We don't care for it. Okay.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Thank you.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Thank you very much for your time and, have a great rest of the day.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Thank you for the consideration.

[Bruce Post (Chair, Essex Charter Review Committee)]: Yeah. Thank you very much.

[Rep. Leonora Dodge (Chittenden-23) – Bill Sponsor]: Bye, thanks. Thank you, Greg and Bruce, for all your work.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Thank you, Leonor. Appreciate the support.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: So committing tomorrow, we have the joint assembly in the morning.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Oh, and in addition to the joint assembly, there is, Greg Knight is

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Oh, yeah.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Addressing the legislature, which I did not know about until David Weeks told me about it. But, evidently, at 09:00, he is also doing farewell address, and we're overreliked.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: So I'm not gonna surprise. I have a question. I wonder, and I'm certainly, while we're still on the Essex charter, I'm certainly happy to be wrong, but I feel like it's fairly straightforward. Maybe the committee might be comfortable voting it out tomorrow?

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Sure. I would know. Right?

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I will put that down on my list, make sure that we do that. So that's five and six.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: That's a bigger committee than five one six.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: It's terrible. The house committee. You can add that to the agenda. Page five one six,

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I don't have any changes that I

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: think Okay.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: No. I think this is straightforward.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Yeah. And we'll figure out Burlington, I guess, next week when you

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: and Tucker get together. We'll get

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: a new language.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Yeah. Tanya's also expressed great interest in February.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Oh, I thought that's

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: what we

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: were taking up now.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Tomorrow. This Thursday.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Oh, sorry. It was It's okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I'm just going back once in front of me. We have these two. I guess I did not hear from the administration. I sort of gave them a heads up that we were gonna check, pick it up. I don't know whether it's of concern to any of the executive officers or not since I haven't heard of it.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Well, may have a requirement to do it already.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I think in some ways they do. This might be a little bit more granular. Yeah. Although, Senator Vyhovsky has also agreed that if we didn't wanna make it as deep a dive No, we could. We could change

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: it

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: something like

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Anything would be an improvement over the nothing that we have tomorrow. And

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: then two fifty five tomorrow, unless I hear from other folks, that's our pilot bill for the law enforcement. I'm planning on voting that out tomorrow as well. We do have Tim Denton, Kim McManus, and Jeremy Evans coming in to talk to us. So if that goes too long, we'll have to wait to find. But I'd like to get it out

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: tomorrow because We have two more people as well. Commissioner John Morley III. We wanted to hear from

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: the state police out there. Could you add those in a request? I had it.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Yeah, we can.

[Greg Duggan (Town Manager, Essex)]: Yeah, they're

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: on there.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: Yeah, I can print the one for you. Okay.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I spoke- Okay.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: The lady is from he's retiring, but he has been having this job for a long time since

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: 2019. The longest we've had leadership in that department. Wow. Well, I didn't expect to

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: be out this early, but the days were

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I think everybody thought I had real concerns with the Essex charter.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: I did, I thought.

[Sen. Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I didn't. I just wanted to hear from the town. They did too. When I reached out to them, they were like, What's wrong with the charter? Was like, Nothing. I just want to know how you got here. Okay. So we're going off it. So we're gonna go.

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Yeah. Anything else for the committee today? Okay.

[Sen. Brian Collamore (Chair)]: With that in mind, we'll move here for the day and

[Sen. Alison Clarkson (Member)]: see all of you tonight.