Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Speaker 0]: Good afternoon once again and welcome into the Government Operations Committee meeting on the Senate side. And this is our final topic of the day. We have legislative counsel with us only for about a half an hour, so I will express my appreciation for him coming in. Yes. You can join us at the table for sure. And even though this was labeled as the reviewer review, I guess, is the verb or the the noun I used, of Act 57, it came about only from nonconstituent who wrote me about a piece of this, not the whole bill, so I'm not feeling any necessity to open the whole thing up again. I do have some specific pointed questions to ask, but I'll just defer to Tucker, who I think I've shared some of those questions with. And just set the stage if you can. We're gonna have folks come in from BLCT. I don't see anybody else on the screen yet.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: I'm right here. Shoes.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. But I think there's three other people that are no. Okay. Yeah. Well,

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: there's Oh, there's Katie.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: That's Katie. There's Katie Buckley. Katie and Marguerite. Yeah. They're my colleagues. Yeah.

[Speaker 0]: Are they going to testify or just listen, do you know?

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: I'll testify and they'll be available at the content specialist if needed. Yeah.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. So,

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: welcome in Tucker. Thank you. Good afternoon Tucker Anderson Legislative Counsel. It's the first time in this session, the first time with the new face of the committee. So just to You met both.

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: No, no,

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: I'm a legislative council working primarily in government operations issues and devices, and you'll likely see a lot of me this session. And one of the areas that I work in specifically is municipal government. And as of last year, dabbling in emergency management, and today we'll talk a little bit about the intersection of those two issues in Act 57 Mhmm. And with the chair's direction and permission, we'll talk specifically about section six of that act, which I believe is where some of the questions you received Right. Were based. That's exactly where they were. So section six added a new section to title 24. You say section fifteen eighty five and allowed for the establishment of an unassigned fund balance at the, local level and the transfer of certain bonds at the end of the fiscal year. So I'll walk you through the language. It's very brief in this section, and then if you have any questions for me afterwards, happy to answer them. So this section allowed monies from a budget approved by the voters. I'll pause. Mechanism for approval of budgets at local level is annual meeting. Voters approve the budget, then the legislative body sets a tax rate to fund the budget. K? So the budget has been approved. Many cases, there are, items in the budget that are dedicated for specific purposes at that time. Okay. So monies that are approved through that process that are not expended by the end of the municipality's fiscal year shall be under the control and direction of the legislative body of the municipality. So once you've come to the end of the fiscal year, you have unexpended funds from the budget that are under the control of the legislative body.

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: And this is just to be clear, this is this is what we I think both senator Clarkson and I were saying last time is our understanding was the MSI and fund balance isn't just like they can do whatever they want with it. With internal like, the town manager can't do whatever they want with it. Still has to go through the select work for a vote.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Right. Okay.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: Under the control of directional legislative body, as a consensus building body has to take a vote in order to take action.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Right. And we delegate our thought. I mean, that's why we elect people to that municipal body to make decisions on our behalf. And we have voted money. And then if that money isn't expended, the understanding was that the thoughtful slug boards they liked would thoughtfully reassign it to something else that the town needed.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: Okay. Let's let Tucker finish. The section this sentence, not just the section, this sentence goes on that further, those monies can be carried forward from year to year as an unassigned fund balance. So, continue to hold this during the year, so add to it if necessary. Unassigned fund balances may be invested and reinvested, as are other monies by the local treasurer, and may be expanded for any public purpose as established by the legislative body of the municipality. So once you've come to the end of the fiscal year, even if there was a specific purpose or an item in the budget, if there are unexpended funds at the end of the fiscal year, those funds go under control of the legislative body, can be carried forward year to year, may be invested or reinvested, and ultimately may be expended for any public purpose. And this is the law, the current state of the law.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Who is having a problem with that?

[Speaker 0]: Well, that's not a question for Tucker. I

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: wasn't asking about that.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. I explained, I thought when we began again, I received an email from somebody in Reedsboro, And I called him back, and we'd had a long conversation about this. He has specific questions. We keep talking about the legislative body, so that's where it's all gonna be focused on my questions. But he he's not a constituent. He's out of my district, but I felt

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: The major chair of the committee of

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: the And

[Speaker 0]: he made, you know, what I thought were some good points and some good questions. So I thought, okay. Well, let's take it up again and see what No. Because maybe this all came out of h three ninety seven, which turned into act 57. And this was only one section of the bill, and I thought maybe, and maybe I'm right, maybe I'm not right. We didn't take a fine enough look at it, getting getting really granular about this, that maybe we put something through that upon further reflection, we wanna go, not sure that's what we wanted to do kind of thing. I'm not saying that's what happened. Please understand. But, again, I thought he deserved, and I asked him to come and present, but, it just wasn't possible to do. So I'm taking the burden from him and trying my best to so that's where it came from.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Senator Wyeth? Thank you,

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: mister chair, and thank you

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: for clarifying. I think

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: it's actually great when we have constituents, whether they're ours or others, if they have specific issues that they're worried about, they come to the chair of jurisdiction. Yeah. I think when you had originally described it, I was under the impression that we had basically given carte blanche to the the the town manager, the non legislative body in the way that you're considered and framed it up. So that I I just wanna say that I am very comfortable with that language. I had misunderstood your constituents concern. That if it was just like the unassigned fund balance could be moved without a motion or a vote by the the select board or alder board, that would be a concern to me, and it sounds like that's not what is happening.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: The legislative body and municipality has to take a vote to Yeah. Carry the funds forward and ultimately to expand those funds. Yes. Yes.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: As far as accountability for it. There's public discussion about it. There's a vote on it. I feel comfortable as well.

[Speaker 0]: So I don't know whether you feel comfortable answering the questions he directed to me to ask or whether we can involve folks from the VLCT. Either way, if you feel the least bit uncomfortable, please let me know and I will let them answer. It's a dangerous offer for some on

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: this call. But

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: no, I'm comfortable answering the questions that I can and will, of course defer to the experts in the room.

[Speaker 0]: And I did understand, as you pointed out in section six, what it was that we authorized. His focus is more directed to the legislative body. So question one, can the legislative body add UAF unexpended account funds to an existing reserve fund without voter approval?

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: Interesting question. Depends on the rules of the fund that have been established. And you may wanna take further testimony from those in the room, from VLCT, who might have more information about how some of those funds are established. But one example that I would give you is enterprise funds have strict rules about what money can be deposited into them and what purposes those funds can assigned to. Additionally, there may be issues with bonding around moving funds between assigned funds at the local level. So it might be

[Speaker 0]: a more nuanced, discussion than first glance. Okay. In a similar veins, can the legislative body transfer money in between unexpected or unexpected account funds and reserves without voter approval? In other words, going all the way back down to a town wide vote. Same answer as before. Okay.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: And when we get to the questions about voter approval, I will say that depending on the type of fund we're talking about, whether it is tied to a form of indebtedness, is going to matter a great deal because there are specific procedures for gaining voter approval from origin all the way through the maintenance of some of those instruments. Okay.

[Speaker 0]: This one is similar, but I think it's it's a little bit different. If a previously established reserve fund has an intended purpose and that reserve is short on funds for that purpose, can that legislative body unilaterally supplement that reserve fund with UAF funds without voter approval?

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: Same answer as the last thing, but I will say that, there were materials from just last session when this was being taken out that VLCG VLCT presented about some instances, where that's what unassigned fund balances are. Specifically for, shortages in reserve funds, but shortages in other dedicated funds in a municipality.

[Speaker 0]: And lastly, does the municipality have to have an electorate approved policy on file? Think you already answered this. To govern the UAF, it includes how much is there is to have in it and just what it can be used or cannot be used for. You seem

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: to indicate that each pund would be set up with kinda guardrails. I will say the answer to your question is that within the four corners of this act, no. The voters would not have to approve that under the control of the legislative body. And I'm not immediately aware, trying to go through the Tucker encyclopedia in my mind, of something I've read in Title 24 that would be binding in that particularly worth talking about Okay. Policy.

[Speaker 0]: Are those the questions? Yes, that's it.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: The one thing that I wanted to bring you back to, and it sounds like you've thought about this, last session I pointed out, I hope I did my due diligence to point it out here, is that the this mechanism puts downward pressure on the voters at the time the budget is approved. That's the largest shift from a legal perspective here. Right? The voters still have an opportunity to approve these monies and eventually, knowing now that this is in law, that they could be put in an unassigned fund balance to review the budget proposed and ultimately determine this is an example we talked about. This seems to be too much for the town highway department's new truck. Where could these funds go in the future? Yeah.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Or the bid comes in lower. I mean, there's just so many ways there might be for these funds.

[Speaker 0]: Does any other have any member have a question for Tucker? Again, I'd love to send him on his way, perhaps a little bit early. And I mean, in the sense that I had till three reserved in my mind, you know? And we appreciate your taking time out. Had a great meeting with Tucker this morning, with some of the other chairs and Alison was there as well, of course. And I think things will proceed even better than they had been before.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yeah, because you're busy. You

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: do excellent service and improved cooperation, having legislative council in the office.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Well, and I think both run and I really appreciate it. We, I'm not sure until last year we had supervisor roles within the Ledge Council. I I we I

[Speaker 0]: don't think I've ever been

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: called into a meeting like that. That was really great. It's terrific. This was a meeting with chairs in his in the area group that Tucker supervises on how we can coordinate better, how we could be more efficient together, how we could train better. It was just all terrific. That's correct.

[Tucker Anderson (Legislative Counsel)]: Most out of legislative council. Sketch. Alright. That's

[Speaker 0]: Have a great weekend. Thank you. Thank you.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Enjoy.

[Speaker 0]: So without casting aspersions on this fellow from Greensboro, it appeared to me, and you could join us at the table for a I probably am gonna get into trouble even by going this far. It just seemed like all of the questions were about the legislative body as though there was something bothering this person about, okay. This is what this thing was supposed to be for. This is what we approved money wise. There's money left over. Can they just sort of separately,

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: hey, let's have a quick meeting,

[Speaker 0]: and we're gonna do something else with the money And as long as that legislative body approved it, it would appear that it would it would be working. So

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Okay. I wonder and and this makes me want to bring Tucker and his encyclopedic memory back, but I feel like there are some parameters on things legislative bodies must have public hearings around, and I've

[Speaker 0]: been No. There is. There is.

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: Okay. So I don't I don't know that they could just do it in the corner. Yeah. Let's just go on

[Speaker 0]: the trip to Bahamas. So for the record?

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: For the record, my name is Samantha Sheehan, the municipal policy and advocacy specialist for the Vermont League of Cities and Towns. As a reminder, we represent all two fifty one municipalities in the state, or cities and towns in the state, even more villages. And every municipal official in Vermont government is a member. So appointed, elected, and professional employees. I will ask now Katie and Marguerite, will you introduce yourselves either with your name and title?

[Speaker 0]: Sure, I can lead off. I am Katie Buckley. I am director of the Municipal Operations Support Team at Vermont League of Cities and Towns. For the record, my name is Mariet Ladd and I am a government finance specialist at Vermont League of Cities and Towns.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: K. Welcome. And they're the two best phone of friends you could ever have in attempting to explain the the powers and authorities of non assigned fund balance. And I really appreciate being here. Last year, the flood bill carried actually five of the league's biggest priorities. Certainly, were here many times to talk to you about it. And it was a packed bill. And we I agree. We didn't have a lot of time to get into the details and nuances of unassigned fund balance authorities. I'm happy to do that now because it's a really useful and powerful tool for Vermont municipalities that helps protect Vermont taxpayers and residents from ever rising property taxes and control the public cost of borrowing and debt. And it helps ensure that in times of crisis and economic downturn that the public services municipalities provide can continue. So I just need to be allowed to share my screen.

[Speaker 0]: We got this by email as well. Cool. Okay. Josh was just here. And Alison has it.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Okay. So we discussed this. I'll skip this. Act 57, one bill, had these three sections. Section six is the one we're discussing today.

[Speaker 0]: Yep.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: So I think it would be helpful if I start with some definitions. Yep. So when we talk about fund balances, this is not like a checking account or appropriation. An appropriation is an authority to expend. A fund balance is simply the difference between the assets and liabilities of a town. Some municipalities have relatively simple balances and others have very complex balances. But when we're discussing a fund balance, there's actually a fifth type which is called unspendable, but that doesn't come up as much. So these are the four major fund types that we use in all governmental finance, all cities and towns and states. So the first is restricted. These are revenues, resources, monies that can only be used for a specific purpose that is dictated by an external party such as a grantor or a law. So for example, TIF revenue is a restricted fund. State law restricts how TIF money can be spent or not spent. Committed resources are very similar to restricted, but it's basically an action of the municipality that has restricted those funds, not an external party. So if a select board passes an ordinance which creates a housing trust fund and says, in the future, rental registration fee money will go into a housing trust fund, then those are restricted funds created by the municipality that go into the housing trust fund. And to undo that, you would need the same legal action by the legislative body. So you would need to change the ordinance through a resolution. Assigned funds are basically intended for a purpose, but not restricted by some law, local or state or federal. So for example, super common, lots of towns have parades. They charge a registration fee to get your float in. But before the parade happens next July 4, they still have to get porta potties. They need to have the sheriffs there to manage traffic control and public safety, and they need to rent trash cans or whatever they need to do for the parade. So they're gonna use last year's revenues from the prior year fiscal budget for next year's parade. Those are assigned, but they could legally be moved around. They're not restricted by a law. And then the last category is unassigned funds. So these are just not encumbered by these three other common circumstances.

[Speaker 0]: Yes. Senator Walker. Thank you, mister chair. How about patent reserve funds that was voted on by the voters?

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Mhmm. So depending on how the reserve was created, it would probably most commonly be a committed fund.

[Speaker 0]: Okay.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: And same thing, it would need the same type of action to un commit.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. So because every year it comes up Yeah. In on the warning, x amount of dollars for this, this, this, whatever. Yeah. Yeah. So committed. Yeah. Okay.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: There are I mean, there are reserve funds that could be created by the legislative body.

[Speaker 0]: No. This this?

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yeah. So it just sorta depends on how it was created. Okay. How it's yeah. So in governmental finance, there's a fund balance, which is includes all of these funds types and the fifth kind, which is called non respectable. And this is just simply the balance between the assets and the liabilities. In the private sector, the not in government, this would be called working capital. Right? This is like your debts and your ongoing expenses and expenditures are subtracted from the money that you have on hand and are expected to receive. That's your working capital. So the fund balance for a municipality is the resources available to it to meet its obligations and plan appropriations. The fund balance is a really important tool that indicates the health, the overall financial health of the municipality. A fund balance should never be zero. Like, it is not advised by the professional governmental, like, finance organizations to to maintain a zero fund balance. And it it's also a indication you're skating on really thin nights. Like, you may not be able to pay your employees. You may not be able to keep flowers running. Right? Should we should never be in that situation. Now, an unabundant fund balance is the balance of those funds, which are not restricted, committed, assigned, not spent. So these are revenues that are generated other ways and are not otherwise restricted in their use by laws of the state, laws of the federal government, actions of the town government, or other agreements with external parties like grantors or through regional agreements, municipal cooperation agreements, etcetera. So that's what an unassigned fund balance is. These are commonly used, have been commonly used in Vermont for a very long time by many municipalities and certainly around the country. So this is what this graph comes from our colleagues in New Hampshire, And this shows ideally sort of like what a healthy cash flow and fund balance looks like in a municipal fiscal cycle. And remember that in Vermont, our revenue authorities for municipalities are extremely limited. And primarily the revenue that a town takes in is from property taxes, which are paid quarterly. However, the expenses that the town is committed to through the appropriations process and according to the need of the public services it provides are not quarterly. They're every day, every week, every month, the town is having to spend money. I put a little circle at the beginning and at the end so you can see in a in a healthy financial situation, the fund balance is exceeding the cash flow at the beginning of the fiscal year, as well as at the end of the fiscal year. Although they may dance a little bit in the middle when there are periods of time where expenses are much higher than revenues for a period. If you have a healthy fund balance, and in particular a healthy unassigned fund balance, that can help the town avoid emergency debt and short term debt such as a common, very common one, tax anticipation note. So if the town knows it may be $10,000 short on its June expenses, it may take out a tax anticipation note of 50,000 so that it can clear its payroll for June. But it's of course paying interest on the 50,000, which is a cost to the taxpayers of the town. We wanna avoid that by just having the money there. So I'm sorry. I'm gonna I, like, can't read as well from there. So Act 57, as Tucker described, grants the municipal legislative body control over these unassigned funds. Select boards, however, are encouraged to adopt a formal fund policy, And a good fund policy that will be liked and graded well by auditors and CPAs and credit rating agencies and lenders would include these elements. So it would define the target balance level. VLCT recommends for Vermont municipalities 15 to 17% of the general fund. And then it establishes conditions for use and replenishment. So it would describe if the fund falls below 15%, what actions should the select board consider to bring it back up to the target level. It identifies corrective actions and it addresses the treatment of excess funds. So same thing, if the target is 15 to 17 and we're now at 20% level of the general fund, what steps should the select board consider to bring it back down? Are there priority appropriations? Do we most want to resolve open debt? Do we most want to lower properties taxes on the next year? Do we most want to maybe move that into a reserve fund? Like the question that Okay. Dropped. And this is not a one and done. This is part of a healthy ongoing budgeting, auditing, and transparent governance of public money. Right? So regularly, this should be checked and discussed. And you may wanna change your target level based off of your current municipal debt, your plans for the future, so you know you're gonna have to build a high school, for example, and take out a 190,000,000 in bonds, you might wanna it's a good time to look at your unassigned fund balance policy and see if you should add or subtract to the target. So that's how an unassigned fund balance works. Why would we have it? Sounds complicated. Isn't it better to just spend money when you have it and raise it when you can? There are a lot of benefits to unassigned fund balances that many Vermont municipalities have used to great benefit for taxpayers. So it again supports a stable and predictable tax rate over time because the town knows that it doesn't need to take on short term or emergency debt for regular operating expenses. And if an emergency happens, such as a terrible ice storm and we're we've blown our salt budget or there's a flood and we have not received FEMA reimbursement, but have box culverts to rebuild. The town knows that those resources are available and it's not gonna apply pressure to next year's tax rate. And then it provides flexibility for emergencies, I already said that. It ensures cash flow during constrained periods of revenue. So prior to quarterly tax collection, It reduces or eliminates the need for short term borrowing. And this is honestly, like, the really big one because municipalities in Vermont are increasingly going to bond for increasingly large sums of money. Yeah. Like, Burlington just had 200,000,000. South Burlington just had a big school bond two years before that. We know. I'm trying to think of one in your district,

[Speaker 0]: and I'm not coming up with one.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: But when you're when a community is borrowing such a substantial amount of money, the difference in the interest rate is real dollars in the pocketbook of Vermonters. Right? Like, if the the all that a responsible legislative body, Blackboard City Council can do, mayor, to bring down to raise the credit rating of the town and bring down that cost of interest, help save people money in the over the life of that debt. And then what's next? So the unassigned fund balance authority created by Act 57 became effective in July. For towns not currently using this authority, this town meeting would be their first chance, right, to move over these unassigned funds, which are, again, like unplanned for revenues or savings into next year's f y twenty seven budget. So VLCT is soon to release a new model fund balance policy for a town that needs one. And this the the model fund policy, like all policies of a town, would be acted on and adopted by a vote of the legislative body. So the select board or the city council. So just like their debt management policy, just like a policy that may dictate minimum or maximum amount of expenditures that need to actually go to the select board. Like, sometimes a clerk can spend up to a thousand dollars for the select board needs to vote on it. Or the mayor may expend up to $50,000 or the select board needs to vote on it. Right? That's a financial policy of the town that is acted on and created by an action of the legislative bodies. So, anyway, we recommend having a policy, and we're gonna put out a model policy shortly. And then just like every other day of the year, all members of VLC team may consult with our municipal operations support team with any questions, concerns, and for assistance in taking these public actions. I also somehow forgot, like, the most important point, which is the any actions by the legislative body to create, maintain, or extend resources from an unassigned fund balance are subject to all normal laws. So open meeting law, public records law, if it's also subject to any existing ordinance or policy of the town, such as if they have a debt management policy that may exist in relationship to the unassigned fund balance, and the rules at the bottom. So the select border city council respectively, of course, operates according to rules and may require a minimum vote, a minimum amount of time between a decision. They may have rules about whether or not new or old business can be taken up in a a fiscal year. Right? All of these rules are still in place in order to ensure transparency and good information and opportunity to engage with the public. And I will just show you this, this is in the PowerPoint, so in the PDF version you can click on any of these for even more information or to share with any constituents or your town officials that have questions. Now I'm gonna stop screen sharing so we can see Margaret and Katie. Yeah. Okay.

[Speaker 0]: Thank you, Samantha. Any questions from the committee on this? Yes. Senator Morley, wonderful job. Yeah. Really? Ours is a bit more complicated. We have enterprise funds with Yeah. Water, wastewater, electric utility, things of that nature. Mhmm. But one thing I just wanna impress upon the committee really is that we we get audited. Mhmm. And they'll break them up

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: Mhmm.

[Speaker 0]: Into unassigned assets or and and they they show you the fund balances and whether most of time we go out.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Mhmm.

[Speaker 0]: And and all that stuff. It gives you a real good idea of the strength. And they also I I asked for recommendations from the owners. Mhmm. And so they they told me they like a two to three to one ratio between current assets and current liabilities. So I I you know, I'm paying them, so I might as well get something out of them. But that was really, really helpful. Mhmm. I'll have to go through and look at some of the policies that you're taking a look at.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yeah. All the, gap auditors, so that's the type of audit you're discussing done by a certified or a

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: CPA.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: CPA. Yeah. They all recommend or in fact require unassigned fund balances. It's a way to communicate to the public in a Yeah. More explicit way what funds are within the municipal I

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: will say the problem.

[Speaker 0]: The majority of people don't fully understand the audit reading the audits, though. Mhmm. It it you have some background in that stuff. Okay. Any other questions? Well, looks like you've got early afternoon, at least in this building. So thank you to both Marguerite and Katie and to Samantha. And again, I need to say this at the end because if at any point there was a perception that we didn't think that you guys were kind of on the ball and doing the right thing and that we somehow aired last year. This was strictly a thing of, okay, give us clarity so we know that what we did was what we thought we did kind of thing.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Happy to do so.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. Senator Glucks.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Good test. So I know

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: we haven't had you in to focus on your priorities for But the we have begun to discuss our priorities, and I forgot a priority, which is the ethics commission. Ethics commission is really such an orphan at the moment, and they need us, and I think that's a priority. I do wanna bring back to the fore, but one of the priorities is expanding and maintaining a permanent flood resilient communities fund. I assume you guys would support that as a priority and would be willing to shout out it with us.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: The one for municipalities. Flood resiliency is absolutely a priority of VLCT and we're happy to learn more about what sort of vision I am. Yeah, of course. Okay.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: And we're they're coming in next week to chat about

[Speaker 0]: the Are we gonna go over next week? Yep. Just a bit.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Yep. Okay. I'm sure.

[Speaker 0]: Would you be available next week?

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yep. Work it out. Yeah. Yeah. I'll work it out. Yeah. We have one We already have listen. So excited by the energy of the legislature to bring into this session, but it's been a busy week. Next week's shaping up too busy, but we'll sort it out and make sure we're here.

[Speaker 0]: Okay.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yeah.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Great. Thank you very much. We always entertain. Guess one's got wheels

[Speaker 0]: on

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: this for this session. First two years.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: So let

[Speaker 0]: me go over quickly next week and then the rest of the committee can add out. Again, Tuesday, we have the Senate floor, and we also have mandatory training after the Senate floor. And then we're gonna hear from the candidates for the adjutant general with the combined House and Senate Government Operation Committee meeting in Room 11 at one. I'm allowed two hours. I don't know if we're gonna use all two, but I don't really have anything else on deck for that day. So that's Tuesday. Wednesday, we're hoping that we're gonna get Sarah Clark, the agency of administration secretary to come in for their priorities at two, and then at three, S164, which the other one was introduced S-two

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: So twenty

[Speaker 0]: I'm not sure the best way to handle that, whether we take those up separately or whether we ask Senator Vyhovsky and Senator Watson to noodle and figure out the best way to do that.

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: We can start there. I'm gonna have to get connected to Senator Watson ahead of I privacy on that don't know. I haven't seen.

[Speaker 0]: Well I read the one that was introduced, it's quite, there's a lot more to it And than just I don't know whether that would complicate passage or not, but.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Well also this is just health benefit as opposed to.

[Speaker 0]: Right. There's a bunch of other stuff included. Anyway, Jen Carvey will be in one of the things I learned today at the meeting with Tucker was if you're gonna do a walkthrough and you have a sponsor and you like to give the sponsor five or ten minutes of fame to present their ideas, do the sponsor first and then go immediately to the walkthrough and don't ask questions of legislative counsel that aren't appropriate to ask. You can't say, well, what was that supposed to do? What what was that intended for? Because they can't give you the answer.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: I have the sponsors there to sort of talk about why they introduced.

[Speaker 0]: So s one sixty four is on the schedule. It's going to give at least the opportunity for health benefits for members of the General Assembly. We'll see where we go with that. If we want to dovetail Senator Vyhovsky's bill into that, we can.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: That might be interesting. It would be great if you guys would do them, but I think We're

[Speaker 0]: gonna what we can

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: about that. We leave Tuesday, though, if we have an extra hour, we could do we could do a VLCT updates. Sure. I mean, it's something to consider from three or four.

[Speaker 0]: All pencil or pen that in. What do you think? Yep. And if you wanna get ahold of Josh Hanford, because he's the ramrod of that show And Sam. Let him know that we would probably by 02:30 ish Is it gonna take an hour and a half to interview two people? No. It's not.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: So they should be on deck late two. Is that what you're trying to say?

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. Or even from two. Yeah. They might Let's shoot for 02:00. Okay. So then Wednesday, just talk Thursday, s twenty three is coming back to us as was obvious on the floor yesterday, I think I did okay explaining why. You did very well. We did was we ran out of time for them to message it back to us. That's the only thing that was hanging it up. Did talk to Rick Siegel this morning. They did make some changes to it. Yeah. So it it may not be a simple matter of saying, oh, yeah. That's right. That's right. Let's go. But anyway, he's gonna come in on Thursday at two to explain what the difference is worth, and Shay Waters Evans from the other body who's in the house side will be with him to tell us why they did what they did. And if we move to approve their amendments, then that bill will finally get passed and be done with. Then in the three, we have the DPS coming in, Jennifer Morrison and Lisa Mylot, the animal welfare person, is coming in. And then on Friday, we have Senator Clarkson up first as a sponsor of S one ninety six. And Ken Wood is the

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Oh, good. Ledge counsel, so maybe we're gonna have him a quicker Did

[Speaker 0]: you get that one, Everett? Cameron Wood is ledge counsel. So after both cause you'll notice on what you may not have a common illusion. No worries. Cheryl Hooker.

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: Yay, Cheryl.

[Speaker 0]: Is coming in. She's a former state senator and she was in concert with Senator Clarkson to bring this issue to the board. So we'll have the two of them explain why they did what they wanna do, and then we can have Cameron come in and walk us through the bill. And then, I know you're all looking for this, at 02:00, a security briefing in this room with Agatha Kessler, the sergeant Arms, and the chief of the Capitol Police and some of the Capitol Police law enforcement folks. And that's the deal. It does need to be filled out maybe a little bit, but I think as we move along next week, we can do that. Oh, it should be it's good. Okay. Well, maybe we don't need to fill it out.

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: And, mister chair, I know

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: that we

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: have the voting right acts bill that I mentioned is going around, and I'm hoping that we'll have it submitted by Tuesday, to submit it Tuesday. So it could be introduced as early as Wednesday then.

[Speaker 0]: Oh, then we could take that up late late late in the week. That's what I was thinking. Maybe we could do, like, a bill intro of

[Samantha Sheehan (VLCT Municipal Policy & Advocacy Specialist)]: another one and just keep it open.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: Yeah. The other thing we could do is, even though there isn't a bill about it, is invite the ethics commission in for an update.

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: There is a bill. You should check their inbox from December 2 because I sent it to you to take a

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: look at. Oh, oh my god.

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: It hasn't been introduced yet, but there is a bill.

[Senator Alison Clarkson (Member)]: And you're looking still looking for a

[Senator Tanya Vyhovsky (Vice Chair)]: I am still looking for Oh a my god. I I missed that. I apologize. Okay. All good. I believe I believe that I'm director of the ethics commission is on sabbatical this, but the general counsel, TJ Jones. Oh, right. He's so good. He's so good. And I the just as a little update to that, the Ethics Commission has actually asked the pro tem to have him come to the whole senate and do a presentation. Oh, okay. He does a great job. He does an excellent job. We've we've asked for a full senate presentation on sort of the ins and outs of of ethics and for legislative function. Sure. So maybe next week, maybe maybe the week after next, and we can chat about that when I make it to the correct meeting time for us to do schedule planning.

[Speaker 0]: Which will be Wednesday and twelfth. Yes. It's on the calendar. Okay. Anything else, committee?

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: Thank you for a great first week.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. Oh, thank you. Thank you.

[Senator Rebecca White (Member)]: Welcome, John. Yep. Well, thank you. You survived week one.

[Speaker 0]: Oh, you have. Well, Well, I'll adjourn for the day and the week and see all of you.