Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Okay. They're alive. Okay. Oh, send it to Chittenden. It has dried or something. Alright. Yeah. We can get back. What that was? We

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: are back, and

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: this is Wednesday and we are H898, an act relating to copper based to fiber based telecommunications network transitions and consumer protection.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Okay. I didn't realize it was so long until you just Not said how long it's the that long.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: That maybe not. So Where's my mom? Let's get that one. Okay.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Let me pull that up. So the 898. What?

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Fiber based telephone service. Alright. So that's making a little more sense. Okay. Okay. That's in the bill, wasn't on the agenda. Okay.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So Maria Royal was the vice state council. And as the act title suggests, this has to do with telephone companies that are transitioning their old legacy copper networks to fiber based networks. And what this bill contemplates, and we'll go through the findings, which I think helps clarify issues, but basically ensuring that customers receive notice as well as information about the types of service available, what their rights are with the new service for the transition, other kind of safeguards regarding the new service. So

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Would the issue on this be I have proper line. The line goes by my house. Once that line goes to fiber, I'm going to get don't it cost to me to string the new fiber line to my house?

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: I don't think it's something about the cost. I think if it's, you know, if it's the legacy provider, they're gonna upgrade the networks, and they would pay for that upgrade. So I don't think the customers would be on the hook for any of those costs. Okay.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Because I know they are on a nice train telecommunications. Yeah. The internet. Yep. Alright.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Yep. So we'll just go through, like I said, the finding kind of explain some of the issues. So the General Assembly finds that when a telecommunications carrier transitions its infrastructure from a copper based network to a fiber based network, it is critical to ensure that existing customers have continued access to high quality, reliable telecommunication service. So, when you want to go to fiber, your voice service be VoIP service, Voice over Internet Protocol. Okay. So, the transition of VoIP service over fiber network may affect service reliability, consumer choices, and access to emergency services, particularly for vulnerable populations, including older adults and those with medical dependencies. In part, what that is getting at, some people have devices, medical devices that operate over a copper network and just ensuring that they understand other devices, are available, make sure that they work, so on. Three, unlike traditional service over a self powered or line powered copper based network, otherwise known as plain old telephone service or POTS, A fiber based service relies upon an optical network terminal, which must be connected to a power source or outlet at the customer's home or business in order to be operational. So, when you lose power, unless you have battery backup, you will not be able to access the internet, make telephone calls over the internet. So, and that's explained in '23. Yeah. It was good. Mhmm. You she's definitely dealt with this issue. Yes. We have. So in the event of a power outage, most backup batteries connected to the optical network terminal will provide VoIP service for up to eight hours. However, backup power systems that provide service for a longer duration are also available. And then five, previously, federal regulations have required providers of facilities based fixed residential voice services, so companies that own their own infrastructure, lines to a residence, that are not line powered, such as VoIP service, to offer for sale at least one option with eight hours of standby backup power, as well as additional twenty four hour option to ensure customer equipment maintain E-nine 11 access during a power outage. However, those federal requirements were sunset by operation of law on 09/01/2025. Six, finally, there is a need for clear customer safeguards to ensure continuous and reliable service during the transition to and in the provision of VoIP service and for enhanced state oversight of customer access to emergency services generally. So, it is the intent of the General Assembly to balance telephone network modernization with customer safeguards during the copper to fiber network transition and to enhance state oversight with regard to ensuring that all telephone customers have continuous reliable access to emergency services. So, the definition of VoIP is, there, it's a pretty standard definition. Interconnected service, a service that can access the telephone and numbering system, make calls. Facilities based, again, so this would be a provider that owns the infrastructure. Fits just to a particular location. It can be wired or wireless. And specifies that this applies to residential voice service. Part of the bill is in subsection B, and these are the notice requirements. So a telecom carrier posing a transition Right. Its network in its service territory shall provide written notice by US first class mail and and email to the commissioner of public service, the E-nine Larocque Board, and all affected customers at least one hundred and twenty days, sixty days, and thirty days prior to the planned transition. And then what is included in that notice, One, the date the transition is expected to occur. The details of service changes, including any potential impact on the customer's telephone service. And whether the carrier will offer a reasonably comparable replacement service in relation to pricing terms and conditions. Three, information sufficient to inform customers about the need to test and verify any auxiliary telecommunications devices such as alarm systems and medical alert devices to ensure they function properly over the new system service. Four, disclosures about whether the carrier is obligated to provide regulated landline voice service to residential customers in service territory. Five, information on the need for and availability of backup power options and battery backup devices to maintain service continuity during a power outage. And then a link to the PUC's consumer protection rules related to billing credit collections, etcetera, which also has a consumer bill of rights as part of that rule. Or how to obtain a hard copy

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: of the rule if a customer would like that. And then

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: seven, information for customer support with the carrier and also for the division of consumer affairs and public information that's within the department of public service. Information regarding the availability of and eligibility for any federal, state, or carrier discount programs applicable to the replacement VoIP service. And then a catch all, any other disclosures deemed necessary and appropriate. Sure. To ensure that the quality of convenience and necessity will not be adversely affected by the transition or discontinuance of service. That's the bulk of the consumer protection, the notice that needs to be sent to all of the customers. Then in terms of ongoing oversight of VoIP service generally, subsection E requires that beginning on or before November 1 and annually thereafter, each VoIP service provider shall file a report with the department detailing the number of customers who have purchased battery backup systems from the carrier, if they offer it, how many have purchased from the carrier, in that case, the purchase and installation costs, if applicable, and documenting any known incidents where 9 one one access was impaired or interrupted due to the lack of backup power. So, if they know, then they would file and report that information. And for us, this is just a subsection f is an enforcement subsection and basically says if a carrier violation of this section, it would be subject to the department's general penalty provisions under section 30 of title 30 and its authority to impose injunctions under section two zero nine.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Correct.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: And then, in addition to receiving these reports, the department would also review quarterly, shall review quarterly the outage reports that are submitted to the nine one one board. This rule require any reports of tax to both telecom companies and the power companies, the electric utilities. And what if an outage meets certain thresholds for a certain period of time or a certain area, then they're required to report that information to the nine eleven board. So the department will be looking at all of that data, as well as the department's phone telecom service availability data and any other relevant data available to the commissioner to determine if there are areas of state particularly prone to carrier or power outages and assess whether locations in those areas may be vulnerable to extended periods of time without access to 911 service. So just monitoring of the market. And then in addition, the commissioner in coordination with the office of the attorney general shall establish a mechanism for receiving and tracking any consumer complaints, concerns VoIP service quality and reliability. There is a requirement for education, consumer education and outreach that the commissioner will develop, And it should be designed to ensure that all customers impacted by the transition from copper to fiber are aware of their right and the carrier's obligations during the transition. And all customers who use VoIP service are aware of the risks and best practices concerning emergency preparedness in the event of a power outage. Then the department, in its annual report to the general assembly, shall include findings and recommendations related to the implementation enforcement of this section. And then in next year's report only, the commissioner shall consider and make recommendations on one, whether the state should establish a program designed to provide financial assistance to customers with low income for costs associated with the purchase and installation of backup power equipment. And two, whether the state should enact additional backup power obligations applicable to VoIP service providers. So this act would take effect on passage and would apply to all telecom carriers on 09/01/2026. Okay. So

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: I'm having flashbacks. We had a whole town that was out from weed and batteries weren't available in any store. Yeah. Yeah. It got to be very contentious. But as we make the transition to, which I think we can now say is inevitable and is going to happen, We do need I mean, trees come down on power and phone lines, then you get cut off. This is Vermont. It snows, but people should at least know the potential here. They should know about we need to check the batteries in there and have backups or other backups, if you have medical equipment of some kind that goes. Right? So, hopefully, We should probably hear from you from The United States.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: So the way I understand it, Maria, is that fiber provider, they do have to offer battery backup for you?

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: I don't think they have to anymore. It was required Yeah. Under federal rules.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: Okay.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: But those provisions sunset September.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: Okay, that's the part that sunsets.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Yeah, so that was part of next year asking a department or the commissioner to look at whether there should be additional requirements, perhaps similar to what was required under

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: So is that a federal sunset?

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: That was a it was Federal sunset. Yeah. By operation of federal law, they had

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: to set Yeah. I mean, SEC, can we rewire? We can.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Yeah. Okay. The state retains pretty broad consumer protection authority over interstate services.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: You're raising

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: an issue that, as you probably mentioned, what's happening at the federal level with respect to copper retirement, discontinuing of There was a recent FCC order this month having to do with modernization of services, of state's retirement. Incredible carriers are required to file an application with the FCC, and there's a review period, so much of the requirements have been streamlined. If you submit certain information, then you get an automatically granted authority to go ahead and do the transition. The issue that's driving a lot of concern is there's also preemption provision in the rule, basically stating that any state law that was in conflict with the SDP says, yes, you may transition to, you may discontinue the service, assuming there's a replacement service available, or transition to avoid service. There's a conflict with the state binding or rule, and that's granted. What's a little bit unclear under the FCC's rule is they do, one of the things they do is they basically define all voice service as jurisdictionally mixed, so not just intrastate or interstate, right, because the FCC has authority under for interstate communications. It states as authority for interstate, which made a lot more sense in 1934. Nonetheless, Right, right. But still, that kind of cooperative federalism of this partnership and joint authority has continued. By defining voice service as jurisdictionally mixed, their argument is we have authority where it is mixed, because it's impossible to comply with both the federal rules and state.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: I

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: don't know that they actually can do that, have the authority to do that. That would be a big change, and it seems to undermine the whole system of, you know, the dual jurisdiction. That was the ruling this month before? The rule just came out, yes, basically, preempting state authority to make decisions that are in conflict with it. I should also mention that providers have to notify and petition the PUC for discontinued service. Sorry, I should have said that first. So, if the PUC were to say, You need to continue to provide the service, or you have The PUC may agree that the networks don't need to be maintained in this instance, or they may find that there are reasons for not granting the petition. But in any event, you should kind of be aware of what's happening. Okay. And as you know, some of the providers, the incumbent local exchange carriers, do have carrier of last resort obligations to provide all customers in their service area with service if requested. I think that's gonna be a big issue, making sure that those providers get authority by the FCC, you know, that would be a big change in Vermont if they were still getting relieved. And I, so I don't think that they are relieved from that, but it is something

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: that's being debated. Interesting.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So if you wanna hear from the CDC or the department about their authority to continue oversight and the extent of that or

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: That should be helpful. No. I think we will definitely hear from the. PSB. Yeah. We'll have a utilities day. Yeah. Yes, ma'am. Other questions.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Okay. It's good. And we are moving on to h seven fifty three. And this is that relating to utility service disconnections and great payer protection.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: And this is the house version of a bill that we have in here. Okay. I think Yeah. That we shortened to. This? Okay. This was center of White's bills. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Because, yes, I know there is that. Yeah. Yep. I think this was coming. Yep.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: So, what this does is it's shall be cited as a Vermont Energy Equity Law. But basically section two, I'll just read it, it's not that long, for the purpose of providing policymakers with the data necessary for monitoring and responding to trends in residential, electric, and gas sectors, particularly with respect to safeguarding and welfare of rates hitters. Commissioner of Public Service shall conduct an annual assessment of involuntary residential service disconnections. The assessment shall take into considerations of monthly disconnection reports that are prepared by electric and gas utilities pursuant to PAC rule. Just to let you know what they're required to report under the rules. They need to include a statement reporting the following information for the previous month. So these are monthly reports, the number of bills forwarded to customers, the number of disconnection notices, the number of actual disconnection, the number of reconnections made within fifteen days of disconnection, the number of repayment plans entered into, the number of repayment plans that were broken, and the dollar amount of delinquencies for which disconnection were made. So that's reported monthly. So Okay. Commissioner will review that information as well as relevant consumer assistance records maintained by its own consumer affairs and public information division and any other data deemed appropriate by the commissioner. And then report findings and recommendations, the assessment on disconnections to the standing phase jurisdiction on or before 01/15/2027. So, just trying to get a better understanding of families related to this connection. Going forward, section three specifies that on or before 01/01/2028 or upon the initiation of any rule making pertaining to PUC, the disconnection rule pertaining to utilities, whichever occurs first. The PUC shall adopt rules that one, curtail electric utility service disconnections during periods of extreme heat as defined by the commission, which may include a lower temperature threshold for households comprising persons who are 62 years of age or older, which is similar to the winter disconnection requirements. And two, clarify that under the rule, the provision that allows you, a customer, to obtain a certification from a physician saying that there's a health hazard if there were to be a disconnection and therefore keep the service billed for a period of time. I believe it's thirty months that can be renewed for an additional thirty months, but only two months. Famously, three months for the whole year, but that's the limit. So, anyway, this is just saying that a licensed physician assistant or a nurse practitioner may issue that certificate. And, in addition, related to the time period, number three, require due consideration of medical judgment regarding the duration of a health hazard indicated in a physician's certificate when establishing a disconnection protection period for adult hazard. So, it makes sense to have a longer period of time than that can be that should

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: be considered and adopted principles. So the question, so is that requirement on a case by case basis or just overall?

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: Doesn't really say. So I can almost see it in the way this reads due consideration of medical judgment, but maybe it is a case by case basis. I don't know exactly though how the PUC would, maybe they would want to put into rule to reflect the recommendation of a provider. So maybe require that in the certificate there is or something along that lines. Then Okay. It seems like depending on the circumstances for an individual, it may require a longer period than others.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: That's right.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Okay. Yeah. You're on oxygen. Yeah. Oxygen. Uh-huh. Yeah. Yep. After x number of days. Alright. And we did have the utilities in when we looked at our ill, but we'll have them back in if they'd like to comment on this one. Make sure we get the independent small utilities in. And we should have the public service of PUC be the best place to talk about? Right now, yeah, it's the provider of last resort, which is Yeah. Which is no. Is been traditionally the landlords as we go to fiber because yeah. We we had that issue with cell phones that don't have to do, you know, there's a charge and Would that be the PUC, the Public Service Board? Yep. The PUC and the department. Okay. Public service.

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: And they both testify Yeah. House Energy. Yeah. And have them come in

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: and talk to us about the provider of last resort and how that will fit in here. Yep. Making sure that people do get emergency service. Okay. Yes. And the impact and if this might have on fees and taxes, that would be both of them to, I think, at the tax department. Because there's a there's a landline. Right? What do we Are

[Maria Royle (Office of Legislative Counsel)]: you talking about the universal Service charge. Oh, well, that would still apply because that's on all On all. So it's on cash and service. So now it doesn't matter whether you're a carrier

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: or. Every bill will a phone bill. Alright. Okay. Other questions, committee? No. Thank you. You're welcome. Alright. We'll take testimony if they'd like to the people we had testimony in our bill. This one is slightly separate. Yep. Eight ninety eight. We'll hear from phone companies, Comcast, all the big players, and I don't Franklin Telephone Mhmm. Has been one we've heard from in here. They're small, independent, and Something. Yeah. Franklin. They're based in Franklin. And you should have contacts up. I mean, you're the contact. Oh, yeah. Local telephone provider? They're a local telephone Oh, really? Yeah. And they have been going we heard from them. They were down during, like, their last 10 miles, and there was one house up the road. And I'm thinking they may have done that. It was a couple years ago. But, no, it is a family owned local telephone provider.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: There probably used to be thousands of them.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Yeah. I think there were there's one down around Ridegate maybe? Either nine, maybe.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: There's Jonathan Wolter, River Piper, on behalf of the smaller ILECs. There's about eight of them now that are left around that are considered the smaller ILECs. Franklin is probably the smallest of them. Yeah. And also, you think about Weitzville, Champlain, Telecom, there's a

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: But they're they're they're big. Yeah. They're a

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: lot bigger now. But there's there's several smaller ones, but Franklin would be more than happy. Franklin was the first for Yeah. We were they're almost Franklin, I would say, about 95%, 88. Literally one or two two spots.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Is there one or two? Was So there was

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: that area. But They got

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: no big we included them in well, when we do a whole CUD

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: Oh, well, I think.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Yeah. Weightfield. Once they were small until they merged with the airplane, and they got to be bigger compared to France. Compared to France. They are still But they're not hump cats, they're, yeah. Oh, a toxin? That's the one I was thinking of,

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: was a toxin. So there's about eight of them in The States.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: Okay.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: They have all carrier of life resort obligations. They're evidence Okay.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: So if you can give some names to Charlotte, we would definitely hear from them, and we will hear from the big guys. Mhmm. And thanks to big guys. I just keep expecting our citizen advocate to come through the door, but he hasn't been seen this year. He was a regular.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: And

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: we should on yeah. August, we should hear from the nine one one board. I think we're actively involved in this has to do with connection with the e nine one one, so you will hear from them. Okay. I think that's it. If you think of anybody else you'd like to hear from, but me and Charlotte now.

[Sen. Randy Brock (Member)]: Alright.

[Sen. Ann Cummings (Chair)]: You're done. We are done.