Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Speaker 0]: We're live.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Alright. Good afternoon, is Senate Education Committee. May, February 5. The first hour or so, we're submitting to results of some work done by the education department for this, the federal education report. At the secretary and members of the staff with us. We are trying to be diligent about the fact that we've asked for reports, we're going to spend the time actually finding out what was in them. Sometimes we just go to shamans and we're not doing that. We're trying to get everybody who we ask to file an report. With that, if you all know the protocol, introduce yourselves, then the floor is yours.

[Speaker 0]: Well, good afternoon. Thank you. We're delighted to be here. This is a really important report because it's driving such strategic work at the Agency of Education to elevate our focus on special education delivery. So for the record, I'm Zoe Saunders. I'm the secretary of education. I am joined by the team here.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Doctor Erin Davis. Nice to meet you all. I'm Doctor Erin Davis. I stepped in as the chief academic officer a little over six months ago now from Vermont, originally graduated from South Burlington High School. It's really been a pleasure to lead the academics work and among the divisions that are under my purview include the Special Education Division.

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: You want to go first?

[Speaker 0]: Sure. Hi there, everyone. For the record, my name is Kelly Murphy. I am the education finance director. Nice to meet you. I'm MD First Day.

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: And I am Ted Gates, senior fiscal analyst working with Kelly.

[Speaker 0]: And Anna?

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: Hi, everyone. My name is Anna Russo. I'm the technical assistance and professional development manager on the special education division.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Okay. Just to go along and then quickly, not everybody knows everybody.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Tejaroni And Stable, Chittenden County.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Nottingham Shittenden, Windham County. Dave Weeks, Rowland County. Seth Bongartz, New Pennington,

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: San Francisco. Terry Williams, welcome, housing. Steve Heffernan, Addison County District.

[Speaker 0]: Good afternoon, thank you again for having us. Today on our agenda, we will provide an overview of a recent report that was submitted. It is an overview of the current state of special education delivery. This was a very important report to drive our strategic plan and also inform some of the changes we've made at the agency through our reorganization in order to ensure we have the right leadership, expertise, support to enhance special education delivery across the state. We will then walk you through the components of our strategic plan, and describe next steps. I know in the interest of time, that second part might be a little bit more condensed, so we'll play it by ear in terms of what we thought. In terms of background on this report, the current state of special education delivery report was required by act 73, and it's important before we go into the details of the data to reflect on the goals of this report. The goals of the report are to improve special education delivery and manage rising cost, to ensure inclusive services in the least restrictive environment in a way that makes efficient and effective use of limited resources while resulting in the best outcomes for our students. The goal additional goals are to respond to the challenges of fully implementing act one seventy three and the lessons learned from implementation efforts to date, to ensure the delivery of special education is responsive to student needs, and lastly, to address drivers of growth of extraordinary expenditure in special education. Before we get into the data, I want to provide an overview of the process by which we delivered this report. We had intensive and extensive data analysis and also engaged practitioners across the state of Vermont in reviewing that data and also lifting up some of the realities on the ground to make meaning of the data and the understanding of the current challenges along with opportunities for improvement. So I will turn it over to Doctor. Davis to share a little bit more about how we engage special education directors and curriculum directors across Vermont to weigh in into the report we shared today. So, as Secretary shared, during the production of this report, we met frequently with the policy sprint team. It was

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: a collection of folks that are in the field across the state in a variety of roles serving special education delivery. And those meetings were really crucial to inform the findings of the report. We really benefited from hearing their perspective. Among the things that they supported us in doing was identifying some places that we had some gaps in the data and helping kind of fill in the context with what they received directly in the field. So, those include some specifics around the effective implementation of instructional practices, the quality of tier one instruction, then lastly, access for all students to multi tiered systems of support. Those are areas of gaps that they are gap areas that prevent us from responding to some of the goals that were identified for this report. So for example, responding to the challenges of fully implementing Act 176 and the lessons learned so far is an area that we'll talk about a little further in a moment, but we do have some data gaps in terms of informing those findings to a level of specificity that we would like to. We've identified the further inquiry that we are hoping to do to get even more specific. Some additional themes that were raised by the Sprint team and our collaboration with them included variability in district capacity to meet the needs of students with IEPs, The continuum of educational environments vary significantly across the state. We know that there's variability that's to be expected with such different settings. But we also know within that variability that in some places there's limited access to highly skilled professionals for students who need these services. Sometimes there's teacher preparation gaps, and additionally, there is a genuine need for more robust ways to measure evaluation and monitoring protocols to assess the quality and the cost of delivery of special education across the entire system. So, charges beyond the scope of just special education. The need to improve in those areas is necessary for the entire education system. You want to be intentional about breathing it that way. The SPRINT team also really stressed the importance of clear communication when we talk to you all, the legislature, about when we're talking about cost. There are some implications with the way that we think of the cost of special education or frame special education as expensive. Really, special education services are expensive as they need to be in order to make our education system accessible in Vermont. Special education is about addressing progress in the general education curriculum for students with disabilities through the services, the goals, and the supports, which ultimately makes up what we referenced as specially designed instruction. It means that the student needs specially designed instruction beyond the scope of what the general education instruction can offer in order to make progress. And we have to be mindful about the ways in which we understand the data because students on IEPs have individualized programming based on how they access the general education. And therefore, we can't look to special education as the reason for rising costs. We're talking about systems here. Right? We're recognizing that special education is presumptive on high quality first time instruction in the general education setting, and that is necessary to improve outcomes for all students, not just those with IEPs. And that's a need in our state right now. You know, we've seen some of the outcome data decline. We really must prioritize and support the academic progression for all students. And ultimately, that includes understanding what's happening at the layer of education in our state that most students are interacting with. So when we say improving the quality of tier one instruction is essential, so realizing the full benefits of inclusion and the full goals of Act 179 What's that? Okay. Yeah, we're saying that all students are I lost my spot. We're saying that because if the environment is not meeting the needs of most students, then we know that students with disabilities and students on IEPs are going to be identified as needing specially designed instruction in order to access that. And that results in an increase in the number of students being identified as needing special education. In order to talk about all of this effectively and actually change outcomes for the entire system, we have to understand the gaps and then address what's happening in the third party. So, by going really deep with students with IEPs and focusing on special education here, there are findings that have implications more broadly for the larger system. Like I said, it does give us a unique vantage point to kind of identify where there are gaps and cracks in the system. We wanna be intentional about not treating a downstream challenge. We wanna go upstream and identify where some of the challenges are originating from and intervene there intentionally.

[Speaker 0]: Thanks.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: There are several main findings that we are highlighting within this report. First, increased student need. Overall enrollment in the state of Vermont and public education has declined, but the number of students with IEP has increased. Additionally, we have growth in students who are qualifying for extraordinary expenses, and that indicates a greater intensity and complexity of need for those students. This information coupled with those rising costs, particularly in the areas of tuition and transportation, reflect both an increasing severity of student need and an unknown variability of in house capacity at schools and districts in terms of staffing and specialized resources for those students. Extraordinary costs have driven nearly half the growth in special education spending over the last six years, while only 15% of over expenditures. So despite driving 50% of the growth, these extraordinary costs make up only 15% of the total amount currently being spent on special education. And when you take it at an even more granular level, that growth is concentrated in tuition costs and transportation costs for students with the most intensity.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Sure. Question on when did and this might seem like a insensitive question, but the state's responsible for education, and we've started to pick up more transportation costs. Why have we done that?

[Speaker 0]: Transportation in this context is for those students that would need a specialized service that may not be available to them within their school or within the immediate boundaries of their districts in some cases. So as we walk through the report, are some larger recommendations and areas that we're about, ensuring that districts have the level of in house supports to meet the full continuum of needs, recognizing that there are still students that have really extraordinary needs and they need to be placed in a separate setting because that's the best environment for them. So it's all part of a broader view, Doctor. Davis had mentioned, as we look at this report and look at the data, it's in the context of the entire system. And so transportation is a cost, but that's also been a symptom of students who need to go far distances in some cases to get the services that they need.

[Sen. Nader Hashim (Member)]: Just a follow-up on your, the heart of your questions, why is the state paying for transportation at all? Well,

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: some, I understand why, because keeps us more equal and equitable between all students and that not everybody gets schooled. But does the state ever decide, you know, that when the cost outruns, you know, and again, this may seem insensitive, but it is in the climate we're in now, is saving money or not saving money, learning how to be more efficient. Is there a better way than always spending the money we are on transportation? If the answer's no, then deal with it. But I that I noticed that in a lot of that our transportation costs continue to go up and that is not part of our, originally part of our education system was, kids used to walk to the local school, you know, and then as it grew, we got buses, and now, again, it seems insensitive, but when we have children that need further, we take on the cost and just wondered if there's a better way.

[Speaker 0]: Think the strength of public education is meeting the needs of all students and recognizing that some students will require some additional services and support. That's part of the governing framework of ITDA that's set at the federal level. I think we can have other conversations around what's the best way to meet the needs of all students. And so as we really think around where are we having programs, like how do we position programs across the state that are more accessible so that it could reduce transportation time? And as we get into the presentation, we'll share with you some of the models we're seeing where districts are able to develop some effective in house programs. We're learning from those and thinking intentionally around where might those programs need to be positioned all across the state so that there's greater access and we're reducing some of those transportation costs. So we're really looking at what are the needs of the students, how best to meet them, and then there's some programmatic conversations I think that we can have that are ensuring that they're more accessible to all students. And that ultimately would reduce transportation costs. Does that help answer?

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: So I'm gonna protect my senator from Addison by being probably more insensitive. And I I I think you're gonna get to it in the slide that's up on the screen now about the percentage of the pre k to 12 at the moment. And so just observation. I'm I'm curious why and it unfortunately, this only goes back about eight years. I'm wondering how that could be reflective over, you know, fifteen years prior to that to see a real trend of what's happening to students. But my point is, personally, I think kids are kids. Students are students. I'm wondering what your experience is on why this trend of special education spending in relation to the kids, is home life, is it culture? What's driving this rather dramatic increase in special education costs and the number of students, again, percentage of enrollment? What's the cause of this?

[Speaker 0]: So I would say one, we are seeing that the acuity of needs of students is increasing, but also one of the major findings that we have is that we need to strengthen the quality of tier one instruction. So the instruction that all students receive in classroom and making that accessible. So we'll walk through some of what we mean by that and what that looks like. We've also identified some specific trainings that would be important for all of our educators to benefit from and really create, you know, shared ownership and support for those students with an IEP. But that requires intentional training and collaboration within systems. Some of the changes we are creating at the Agency of Education are modeling how to provide that overarching comprehensive support, and then that's going down into the district level. But it is a complex scenario. We'll walk through some of those findings. We've distilled it down to, I think there's five main findings that are coming out of this report, and those are directly tied into the interventions that we're supporting as a state within our strategic plan.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: I'll listen to the remaining questions.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Thank you. So

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: as of school year twenty twenty three-twenty twenty four, there were 16,152 students with IEPs, Individualized Education Programs, ages three through 21 in Vermont. There's an ongoing trend of increasing total numbers of students with disabilities on IEPs ages three through 21, and an increasing total extraordinary costs as overall student enrollment has declined. So, red line here is showing the percentage of students on IEPs out of the total number of students enrolled, while the blue line is showing that the total pre K through 12 enrollment. So, while total enrollment goes down, the total percentage of students with IEPs in Vermont is increasing between school year twenty nineteen-twenty twenty and school year twenty twenty three-twenty twenty four. It increased from seventeen point nine percent to nineteen point one six percent.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: Does the data go any older than that? I mean, again, six years is kind of a short runway. We're always talking about trends. Yeah.

[Speaker 0]: I appreciate the question. So you'll see that data in this report, sometimes it's collected in different ways. So sometimes you'll see within the slides that we're reporting on the school year data, sometimes it's the fiscal year data, sometimes it's the federal fiscal year data, depending on that collection. So we try to make note of that in these reports. And to the best of our ability for this analysis, we did go back and we tried to go back as far as before the pandemic to get that point of comparison because we know that the pandemic was quite disruptive to education and we need to contextualize that. But, you know, we do have data further back if there's questions around larger longitudinal analysis. That was just the intention for the report, at least.

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yes.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: On deciding who is an IEP, has that changed dramatically through, from in six years? Is that pretty much stayed flat on, or has the bar been either lowered or raised as we go through the years so that more children who might not have

[Speaker 0]: been in it are now in. So I'll allow Anna to expand further, but I will make mention that there have been rule changes around special education identification. There's also support that our team is doing around developing an IEP, but I'll let Anna expand on that.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: Yeah, before I go into this slide, I will say that there were some rule changes towards eligibility. We don't have enough data for the year since those rule changes to make any conclusions yet. But so that rule changes, if you had a pretend line in this graph, which kind of shows ages three through five on an IEP, students ages six through 21 on an IEP, then the total count of students on an IEP in that green line. So right around that school year 'twenty three line is when that rule changes were fully implemented. But there is not enough data to show how that has impacted our full counts yet.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. And I'll note that, you know, this data that we're sharing now, we're comparing against new trends within Vermont. It's also helpful for us to provide that context in comparison to other states. And so we'll share those details as well.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: A moment ago, I think I heard it, Anna, say something about in the same sentence, you use IEPs and disabilities. Completely different worlds. I'm sure that those students who have disabilities have IEPs, but not necessarily every student who has an IEP has a disability. Might be a behavioral issue or what have you. Can you kind of characterize that a little bit?

[Speaker 0]: Yeah, I'm sorry. Go ahead Anna. Was just thinking. I'm sorry.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: Yeah, I would kind of flip that. So there may be students with disabilities with IEPs, with 504s, with EST plans, with nothing, with some of these things happening at the same time, where students with IEPs need specialized instruction as, you know, as a need from their disability. So all students with IEPs have a disability, but not all students with disabilities have IEPs.

[Speaker 0]: So a student with a disability will have an IEP if their disability has adverse effect on their access to the instruction. Like, if they need additional services or support to access instruction. So

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: I can go through this graph quickly if that is helpful for folks. You'll see here in school year school year 2425, there were 16,354 students in total with IEPs spanning ages three through 21 in Vermont, fourteen sixty of whom were age three, four, and five year olds in pre K. And this graph shows the total number of students on IEPs in Vermont from school year 2019 to school year 2025. I heard the need for more longitudinal data, which we could provide at a later date. Data shows that for most of the period from 2019 to 2025, the number of students with an IEP remained consistent, around 15,500 from school year 'twenty to 2023, with the count rising to approximately 16,000 students in Vermont in school year 2024. Just a quick note about the dotted line between school year 2020 and 2021, federal definitions of categories kind of shifted in how all states have to report this out. So pre that line for school year 2019 and 2020, five year olds were counted just by in grade kindergarten. And then after that line, we separated out five year olds in kindergarten versus five year olds not in kindergarten. So you'll see that there's kind of that dip between school year 2020 and school year 2021. It's not that we lost children. It's that the definitions for how we federally report this changed. And you'll see that in comparison to the ages six through 21 on an IEP in that same year. So, the chart on the left specifically isolates the data for three primary disability categories for students on IEPs, other health impairment, emotional disturbance, and autism. Students with autism as a primary disability category shows an increase of 33 percentage points between school year 'nineteen and school year 2025. Other health impairment has also shown an increase by 26 percentage points between school year 2019 and 2025, and emotional disturbance has remained relatively stable, but it's pulled out on the table to the right for school year twenty two-twenty twenty three due to its higher than average prevalence in Vermont compared to the national percentage.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: Can you go back? That's pretty startling contrast. Some words around Sorry,

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: can you repeat the question?

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: Yeah, so on this slide, can't see the number, but the difference between Vermont at fifteen percent and National four point five percent, percentage of kids with, I think that's ED, emotional disturbance. Can you at least say a couple words about why there's such a difference between Vermont and the national average? Just anything? Yeah. I

[Speaker 0]: would just say, I would note, this has been an area of focus for some time because Vermont's percentages have been consistently higher than the national average. Within our report, the team has provided some, you know, considerations that might contribute to that, but there is further review that is required to really identify causality, but I'll allow Anna to expand on some of the factors that could actually contribute.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: Yeah, I would just also add in that like every state has different evaluation procedures, different ways that they do disability categorization, and different ways that they put the primary disability category. So there might be a bunch of different factors for why Vermont has a higher rate compared to the national average or even compared to other states. When we're reporting out on this data, we are only reporting out on primary disability categories. A lot of other states often use multiple disabilities as a category as well that could capture this as well.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So the other thing about this chart is the the one that the topic that they have total students take through I think it's 12 within 98. Those are the numbers. What about how is it by percentage? Like what's inside of that page or something? Or is that you know is Vermont's 14,000 high low as a percentage

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: 14,000 students on IEPs is that a higher or lower percentage of

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: the country Because the bottom of it shows percentages. It's only if it's an emotional disability. Just learning that the number of students with an IEP is out 14,000 like 50% higher than the rest of the country on average or what?

[Speaker 0]: We do have that comparison to other states and what we've pulled out in our report, which Anna will be able to expand on in a moment, is comparing ourselves to states that are demographically similar. So we'll walk you through those Okay.

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: Next slide. The next couple of slides look at changes in revenues and expenditures over time. So the first slide is for the revenues that the school districts in Vermont received for special ed expenses. Before Act 173, we relied on a reimbursement model. So the first set

[Sen. Nader Hashim (Member)]: of columns on the left

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: is the reimbursement model for those three years. And then we transitioned based on Act 173 into about the census block grant. So that's the two spikes in the middle, the blue and the purple. So that was an increment. The census block grant was a significant increase over the reimbursement model. The other categories include special ed main block grant, the second one, and then extraordinary costs. Reimbursements is the one in the middle that shows the significant increase. So it's a smaller percentage like I said earlier, it's about 15% of universal special ed by responding, but it accounted for about 50% increase over that time period. We also had IDDAB, triple E, state place student reimbursements and Medicaid reimbursements. So that's on the revenue side. I was going to say we also some portion of special ed expenditures are covered with local money, general fund money. So that's revenue stream is not reflected here.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: Second. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I understand, reimbursements have shifted from the reimbursement process to the block grant process, but the job is like 25, 30%. Can you characterize that the reason for the job? Like, anything? People are gonna ask us, do we have to be able to rationalize what have not just a different method, but This

[Speaker 0]: came up earlier today in testimony that we had with House committees, and understanding when we went to the Census Block Grant, there was also a change in the formula for what was eligible for extraordinary costs. So we will be following up to provide deeper analysis that we did last year around that in terms of the intention of that change in formula was to more fully account for the cost. So as Ted mentioned, to fully fund this, it also comes out of local budgets for schools. And so the intention was for this to fully cover those expenses for districts. So we'll go back and share with you how that change kind of manifested in terms of shifting costs related specifically to how the formula changed. That was a request we received earlier this morning and we'll go back to some of the analysis we did previously and follow-up with you so there's clarity.

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: I think it'll be insightful to look at the expenditures the next slide over that same roughly that same time period. So tracking the changes in expenditures for special ed over that time period. So the first money column shows total special ed expenditures from fiscal year eighteen through fiscal year twenty four. During that time period for the first four years or so it was kind of flat which is partly due to reduced expenditures related to COVID that limited the amount of services, special services that could be that happened. And then but in the prior in the last three years there was quite an extraordinary growth coming off of COVID in special education expenditures. So in that total time period the total cost increased roughly about $70,000,000 ballpark. And then if you look at the second set of numbers for the extraordinary costs that expenditure category grew by $36,000,000 So like $36,000,000 out of the total increase of seventy months, so about half. So the increase in total expenditures was roughly around 17% during that time factor which is a little bit less than the increases in in general education expenditures. And that's an important thing. Specialized expenditures. But but out of that increase on specialized side, it happened again. So

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: to go back to that, just make sure. So you're what's your point that if you looked at, like, at, late twenty four for both special education and that it was on par or actually a little bit more than total education cost increases?

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: For those three years, looking at the percentage increases 7.7, five point eight, eight point five, those are sort of on par. That's okay. That's Maybe a little bit lower.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: But those numbers are being driven then at least in part by that. Yeah. It's extraordinary. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Very cute.

[Speaker 0]: Next slide. Great start. Yeah.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: So, this last graph is showing it's now showing the growth in extraordinary costs by disability category. This illustrates the distribution of extraordinary special education costs in Vermont across different disability categories from fiscal year 2015 to 2025. You'll see the categories of emotional disturbance and autism are resulting in more extraordinary costs to provide services than other categories. It reveals that the rising overall costs are not spread evenly, but are instead heavily concentrated in a few specific categories. The graph highlights the following trends. Autism and emotional disturbance are the primary disability categories that contribute to extraordinary special education costs. The costs associated with these two categories have grown significantly since 2015, dominating the total extraordinary expenditure. Chart. The category multiple disabilities and other health impairment also show a notable increase in costs over the period. This could suggest a growing combination complex needs that require high cost specialized services. In contrast, costs for those major disability categories such as specific learning disabilities and speech language impairments have remained relatively low and stable. This reinforces that the financial pressure on the special education system is not due to a general increase in the number of students with disabilities, but rather targeted growth for students requiring more intensive special education services. So, when we take this information combined, it begins to provide us some insight. The overall growth and extraordinary costs, as seen in the first graph, that growth is perhaps influenced by increase in intensive special education cases for students with autism, emotional disturbance, and multiple disabilities, and also perhaps a challenge in our current system's ability to meet students' needs locally. This trend is also directly connected to Vermont's special education funding system. The state provides an excess cost grant to reimburse districts for the extraordinary cost students with time needs. If there are questions about that, we have the school here to support, of course, I'm not the subject matter expert in that area, but do wanna highlight that the data suggests that this funding mechanism is being used more frequently and for a growing number of students in those specific disability categories.

[Sen. Nader Hashim (Member)]: I do have a question. I think you were touching on it. Think I'm getting it, I'm looking at the chart that you have on the screen there, the chart a few slides back, and I'm seeing that the cost for emotional for addressing emotional disturbances is the highest cost, the extraordinary cost for it. Whereas on the other chart a few slides back, the rates of emotional disturbance look like they're on a downward trend. More or less. And so is that just because the cost, like there's more acuity, there's more, it's more complex or is that basically it?

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Yeah, so we're seeing that the needs of students in that disability category are such that they're requiring additional services beyond what previously, I mean, that's creating an increase in the cost because they're noting correctly if there's not a good identification for that categories.

[Sen. Nader Hashim (Member)]: And do we know what those emotional disturbances are or is that too broad of a question? Like what is increasing the severity of it to cause such a significant increase in the cost? Any idea?

[Speaker 0]: Are you looking for examples of student profile, good luck?

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: Yeah, think that's, yeah.

[Speaker 0]: Anna, could you provide an example of a student that would qualify for emotional disturbance that would need some additional services, either in a separate therapeutic school or services that might be contracted at a rate that's higher. Yeah,

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: and I just wanna make a clarification. So when we look at this slide with the emotional disturbance, students that qualify for extraordinary costs, that's around like 700 students that are falling into that category. And then when you're comparing it to this other slide, this is the total number of students with emotional disturbance in our state. So you can see that in school year '25, it's two thousand one hundred and twelve. So those are like the extraordinary costs and the students that have emotional disturbance under extraordinary costs is just a portion of this number. So I just wanted to clarify that.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Thanks Anna.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: I didn't know if

[Speaker 0]: there was

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: a fault for that one.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: But yeah, students with emotional disturbance, they might be accessing separate schools due to some of their behaviors or some of the specific needs. The students that are going to these specialized schools may need very intensive supports for their needs. It could be psychiatry, psychologists. They may need some more individualized support, so one on one supports throughout their entire day.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: I think what maybe the center for the world was asking is, can you describe why a child ends up in that category? And is it adverse incidents? Is that a major factor? So,

[Speaker 0]: I'm sorry. Go ahead.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: So when it comes to like the classification and like a student having the categorization of emotional disturbance, it does need to be kind of decided upon about like a licensed psychologist or a psychiatrist in the school. So there is kind of that marker of that need. So it could be, you know, the general description that is often used and we can provide later the federal definitions for all disability categories, but general description for emotional disturbance could be a general pervasive mood or unhappiness or depression. There's often a tendency to develop physical symptoms or fears associated with personal or school problems. So it could be a very wide range of what the student may be experiencing, and even wider range of what the needs are for that particular student and why they may need to go to some specialized instruction or a separate school for that?

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: No, I'm still actually, yeah, kind of absurd. Still kind of noodling around Senator Hashim's observation, which I didn't catch in the first go around. I appreciate that. So, in two different categories, emotional disturbances and autism, numbers overall combined relatively flat but the cost are going up 300% in ten years. It just really struggling with that. Yeah, I, so I'm not an educator. I deal with you, youth organizations all the time. I don't really see a change in kids. I see a change in response from the community and I just want to get a little bit of rationalization for that 300% job. Because again, we've got to go back to our constituents and have the same conversation. We'd like to be able to represent you know, maybe very bonafide rationale, but we have to be able to articulate the same issue.

[Speaker 0]: So as we go through, we'll talk about some of the system level issues that we should look at as a state in terms of ensuring that we have the right levels of support across Vermont to meet the needs of students. So what we were describing, these students that are diagnosed with emotional disturbance, students diagnosed with autism are also more likely to be in a separate school. But what we're seeing in districts is they're really working to develop in district supports for those students. Sometimes districts are challenged to do that if they are smaller and don't have the scale to be able to pull resources and provide that continuum. So within this report, we're really careful in saying, you know, our our therapeutic schools play a really important role in the system. But there's also an opportunity to ensure that our districts are able to offer that continuum of support and services. You'll see later, there's a gap in that data just because of how we collect and the role of the agency. So the role of agency has a role of overseeing therapeutic schools. Within districts, they may create their own programs. The agency is not involved in overseeing the quality of those programs or collecting data specific to those programs. One of the areas of inquiry is to really look more deeply in those programs because we see that there are some promising practices of how in district supports are being implemented, and we've started to have those focus groups across the stage to qualitatively understand how those programs are being established, how they are resourced and the benefits to students. So all of this is flagging, yes, there are higher acuity of needs, but we're also looking at what are some of the improvements system wide in which we can ensure that we are connecting students to accessible services that might be in district or closer, and also still understand there is a role for our therapeutic schools where that may be the least restrictive environment for some of our students that may need to be placed in a separate school. So, I think what you're hearing in this report is we certainly are identifying some key findings, and we are contextualizing that within the broader system of how we deliver education. And we've been able to outline what we think are the most critical interventions and professional training statewide to support, along with really contemplating some of the changes to the NCEP-three of getting to scale and equitable funding so that all students have access to this continuum of support. But it's an area that's, I think, very promising. We're having a lot of really generative conversations with districts that are operating these programs that we're learning from along with our therapeutic schools as well to ensure that we're structured in a way to best move these students. Do want add to that?

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: We wanna be careful about that. Yes. Because of the systemic challenge, like, it's not quite so clean to say that there's one clear cause and one clear event. Right? So, we're being intentional about, you know, trying to narrate the complexity of it. I mean, I do think that, you know, that that range of years to years does coincide with what we also receive overall decline in student performance in Vermont. So, yeah, I mean, I think there's a number of systemic things happening within that ten year range for all students and for seeing what the downstream impact on students with disabilities and IETs are, right? So what

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: is the genesis of the data? How did we come up with this? Is it school reporting to ALE and did we report this to the federal government?

[Speaker 0]: Absolutely. Okay. So all of our data is coming from the LEAs, the districts, then we do report much of this to the federal government, yes, for it. And the other piece I would add, and we'll get to a little bit later, Act 173 was passed back in 2018, and really acknowledged that in order to strengthen the delivery of special education, we had to strengthen the entire education system. And so those best practices that we put into place are designed to enhance the quality of that tier one instruction for all students and making sure that all students, whether or not they have an IEP, have access to those targeted supports. So what we're finding in our reports and we're finding what Erin described is that those are the right best practices that were codified into law, but the implementation challenges have resulted in inconsistency across the state of Vermont. And that is why we are focused within our strategic plan of providing the right level of professional training and support so that those best practices can be put into place because we need to strengthen the quality of all of our general instruction. It's a prerequisite for us to be able to enhance special education delivery and to ensure that those students are getting early and targeted intervention early in their academic career, right? So that if they're having some challenges with accessing content or achieving grade level standards, that they're getting that early support.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: I'm just Sorry. I don't know, stop. I'm I'm a

[Speaker 0]: little here, but you'll think about better.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Just put everybody on notice, we're not gonna make it.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. So don't

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: even try. We're

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: gonna have to have to And go

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: we've been asking a lot of questions, and that's great. But just so, like, don't don't even hurry because we're not gonna make it.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. Cool. Could we come back?

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Yes. Okay. I'll be back next week. Okay. Because we actually want to do this. Yeah. In fact, we could even do it. We have a little time tomorrow afternoon if you have all happen to be able to do that at around. We could not be able to meet. We could not till we could start this out. You hear it like 02:15 or even two, we'll take you down. 02:00 if that happens to work.

[Speaker 0]: So I think you heard me, I'm out in the East and I have some other visits as well.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: We can time.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. We would love

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: to. We'll it in next week.

[Speaker 0]: But you're asking all the right questions. These are all the questions that we've been asking, and so I think what I hope is a takeaway from the conversation today is we've identified the challenges, and now we're working on implementing strategies that are going to overcome those barriers. So we have clarity around the right best practices and we have clarity around the challenges and we're working collectively with practitioners across the state of Vermont to design these.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: I was really interested hearing about that. That part especially. But you had there were two more questions here.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: So just just one more one. Go ahead. You've gotta follow on with what I answered. But so the data is important. Yes. And then you said it was time to federal to state funding. So is it tied to federal funding too? I mean, we, the more accurate the information is, the more federal dollars you're or gonna is that still the case?

[Speaker 0]: So the accuracy of data goes into our, the federal government evaluating the quality of how the state of Vermont delivers special education. And so that's more of the connection in terms of the quality because the federal government has a role in oversight of the states that we are in compliance with the letter of the law for by DEA in this case. And so the quality of data is one of the indicators that they evaluate all states on, along with our ability to effectively meet that indicator switch, Anne, as an expert, can walk you through all of the indicators that we are required to be in compliance with. That answer your question. Yes.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: So we've seen a steady increase. Has there been studies to why we believe this increase is happening? Could it be the legalization of substance use or that substance use became more prevalent in the 70s, 80s, 90s, and it's having an effect on our children? Have there been any studies of that, everything seems to be driving up? And the only reason I ask is you're in that realm and maybe there has been studies in that, or has that even been looked at?

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: I'm not aware of any. As we've shared, one of the main things is just first time instruction. So, if you think about the student who enters kindergarten and rather than mastering a 100% of the content that they're supposed to do that year, on average, the students in that class will only master 80% of the quality of instruction is not strong enough. We think about a student with disability, it may be an even lower percentage. Now, they go into first grade and if the same thing happens, it could pounce on itself. And so increasingly, subsequent year after year, a student with a disability is going to grow the gap even more drastically between where they should be performing and where they are performing. And so really, we're hearing very clearly from the field that this needs to go upstream and address the first time, the quality of the first time instruction, we really believe is the biggest intervention that we can make right now in support of all students and especially students with disabilities and IEPs. And again, that does coincide with the overall outcomes that we're seeing across the state for all learners over approximately the last ten years. And it does predate the pandemic. I'm not aware of studies specifically linking some of the social challenges that you're identifying, or, you know, folks there within the education system, that's

[Speaker 0]: the primary thing I would point to.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Because, yeah, I'm just gonna follow-up. Because when, I can say most

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: of us went through school, it was, you know, we went from class to class, grade to grade, if you didn't pass, you redid the class, and they, and I see we're getting more personalized. That's basically what's happening in our school system, it's more personalized that if you are having an issue, because I, I read terribly, I've always read terribly, and maybe that could've been picked up when I was in first, second, third grade to help them. That's what it sounds more like, because for, when I talk to people in my generation and that, they go, When we went to school, was this, this, and this. Why has it changed so much? And like I said, when you have constituents asking, it's like, because we are trying to get more personalized. As we get more personalized, our costs are gonna go up. I don't see any way around it. When you start doing IEPs, that's a personalized education for that one child, I don't see how it perceives, but it's not the wrong thing to do. It's just you're making it affordable.

[Speaker 0]: You can describe this really well. I think one of the things we talked a lot about is personalized learning allows students to demonstrate their mastery in a variety of ways. And it also signals to the teacher if a student is ready to take on more rigorous, challenging content and to accelerate, or a student might need some additional skills gaps, might need some additional remediation. What we're doing in terms of the statewide graduation requirements is ensuring that we have a consistent rigor and that there's clarity around the content standards. So that personalized learning is happening, but it's in relation to a clear understanding of the expectations around what that student should learn and know how to do at that grade level. And so if they're not on track, it might take them more time. That's actually why we have extended learning opportunities and we have universal afterschools. There's opportunity to provide reinforcement. That's why we're looking at multi tiered systems of support so that those students that need extra help are getting that extra help. But a lot of the, you know, establishing the statewide graduation requirements is ensuring that we are really clear on those expectations around what students should learn and be able to do. We know that that's important for them to be future ready beyond graduation, and it has an impact on how we look at the entire k 12 system and really strengthening our focus on the content standards. And You've spoken to that beautifully. Do want me to expand on that?

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Yeah, I can share a trend that I'm seeing. As I mentioned, tomorrow I'll be out in the field again as I'm visiting schools across the state. It's folks using intervention curriculum and instructional material in place of the grade level curriculum, one, first time tier one instruction. And you're never going to intervene your way out of first time instruction challenges. It will only compound itself. The way that you actually address those gaps is by giving double doses. So, they should be getting access to on grade level content and be getting opportunities for those intervention supports to close the gap. It's a systemic change, right? If you don't have the resources, the schedule, the conditions in place, the staff with enough expertise, etc. It's very challenging to be able to deliver on those stuff, doses like that. But in general, the trend that I've seen, even setting aside the outcomes that we're seeing in terms of student achievement, the instruction and the availability of high quality instructional materials on grade level being used appropriately for that first time instruction has been a pretty significant dash that I've seen so far in my business.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So what you're saying is basically don't let the gap happen in the first instance. That's early. And because I've heard principals said to me, talk about it's by the time your fifth grade, 20% to 20% to 20% interest given

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: And what I would add to that, then their behaviors increase. If I'm struggling in school and I'm not feeling successful and I don't feel like I belong, then my behavior is like

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So the notion of not letting that gap happen makes

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: That's right.

[Speaker 0]: Those are a lot of the strategies we'll talk with you about for transplant. Well,

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: I hate to do this to people. Didn't we can obviously not allow nearly enough time. Can propose one question for now that in preparation for the next visit?

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: So, Doctor Colby provided lots of data input last year on foundation formula specific to special education. This past Tuesday, the Vermont Council of Special Educators came in and challenged those values and I'm just wondering if if we can get any kind of reaction from AOE because Act 73 has been signed, got categories in the foundation formula. So we need to kinda understand, do we need to revisit those or we need oh, you know what?

[Speaker 0]: I can provide a little context. So the original proposal that the government the governor recommended kept the census block funding for the very reason that we felt like we needed a little bit more time to understand the implication on achieving maintenance of fiscal support and maintenance effort, which are required by the DEA. Think they they shared the governing regulations around that. When the legislature shifted to adopting a different foundation formula with the recommendation to move to the weights, we have been evaluating what conditions need to be in place in order for that to be successful in achieving the goals established in Act 73. So we note in this report that we have a secondary report that will be coming to you this legislative session, and we have commissioned experts in special education finance, who will be evaluating the advantages, disadvantages of moving to a weighted model for special education, and conducting a, really a policy review of how other states that implement that model, how that has been effective, and particularly as you hear, we what we're talking about is what are the conditions that need to be in place in our districts and our schools in order for that to be a successful outcome, and we are being very cognizant of those impacts on maintenance, fiscal support maintenance efforts. So that report hopefully will be supportive of the decision making of policymakers. I'll also note that the Joint Fiscal Office will be contracting with experts. I understand that that will be happening soon, and part of the objective of their study is to fully evaluate how those weights will be applied. So we're hopeful that the additional input we can provide will be supportive, but I will share that the Agency of Education's consistently worked with the Joint Fiscal Office in comparing all of our data and assumptions and going line by line down to the dollar. And so we've raised some of these questions that we're all aware of and are working to address. So more information is forthcoming because we feel like it is such a critical area that needs to be focused on because we can't underfund special education. And so we are working toward that, I'm happy to provide more details around our process. Does that help, Fairfax? Very much. Thanks.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Great be in touch. Excellent.

[Speaker 0]: Looking forward to it. Okay. Thank you for your time. Yeah.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Thanks. Thank you for coming in there. Thanks. Actually, it's almost good it's a two section, this because

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: No. But you It's a lot

[Speaker 0]: to absorb. It'll make us work. Yeah. Yeah. I'll put the chairs back for you. She's a.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So if we have people, we have our recruiting leaders, have this.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Oops, sorry. So, we didn't actually go off live ever but we are switching gears from special education to how to go recreation day. And I know you're here in the Statehouse and a whole bunch of people here for the day which gave all of us about value to the state of our citizens. I'd like to do that for some time and we wanted to get some time. So, whatever floor you want to do this, so the general rule is actually we'll introduce ourselves in a Bennington Committee and then just as you come on whoever it is just identify who you are what you do and what time you live in. So we'll start over here.

[Sen. Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member)]: Kesha Ram Hinsdale, I usually see you all in Economic Development and Continuing Education.

[Sen. Nader Hashim (Member)]: Hi, Nara Sheen from Windham County.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Good afternoon, Dave Weeks, representing Rawlton County District, some Walmart's independent Senate District. Terry Williams from Rotland District. Steve Heffernan from

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: the Addison County District. So

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: whoever is going, Ron, are you in first?

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Ron.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Okay. You are on.

[Brian Lamoreaux (Green Mountain Sustainability Consulting; VOBA)]: Great. Thank you for having me today. I'm Brian Lamoreaux. I am from Newport Center and I own and operate Green Mountain Sustainability Consulting in Newport Center.

[Anna Russo (TA & Professional Development Manager, Special Education Division, VT AOE)]: Should

[Brian Lamoreaux (Green Mountain Sustainability Consulting; VOBA)]: I continue with my with the testimony, or does everyone need to introduce themselves?

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Nope. You're good to go.

[Brian Lamoreaux (Green Mountain Sustainability Consulting; VOBA)]: Okay. Thank you. Well, thank you for the opportunity to speak today on behalf of the Vermont Outdoor Business Alliance and for giving us time as part of Outdoor Recreation Advocacy Day. We applaud this committee's work on strengthening an education system that leads to rewarding employment opportunities for Vermonters. I'm going to talk about VOBA's workforce development initiatives, which not only provide technical skills training to trail builders, bike mechanics, and ski technicians, but which also align the state and industry systems around jobs that are essential to climate adaptation and resilience in our outdoor businesses, organizations, communities, and the landscape. A little bit about me. First, I grew up visiting Vermont for outdoor recreation and was attracted to Linden State College in the mountain recreation management program. And in 2020, I got my undergrad degree from what is now the Vermont State University Linden's outdoor education leadership and tourism program. I learned all sorts of transferable skills, both technical and general, which made me very hireable across the industry. And win winters I spent at JPEEK making snow. Sugaring season brought me to Sweet Tree and Jed's Maple maintaining sap lines. Spring was at Northwood Stewardship Center on watershed conservation crews. And then summer and fall was spent with the Green Mountain Club as a caretaker and working on trails. Its seasonal cycle working outdoors instilled in me a deep love for Vermont's natural landscape and the close knit communities, and I've loved being able to continually learn through that cycle. Of course, I realized that in I'd never be able to raise a family with so much bouncing around, chasing employee housing, and I grew to understand more about Vermont's re very real environmental and social challenges. In seeking to understand how capitalism could be harnessed for the benefit of our natural and human communities, I enrolled in the sustainable innovation MBA program at UVM, where my coursework led me to appreciate Vermont's outdoor sector that contributed 2,100,000,000.0 to in 2023 to the state GDP and employing 16,000 workers. And I began to understand how the the sector is uniquely positioned to be a leading force for good. Since then, I've been consulting with FOBA, which is a nonprofit organization of a 155 businesses and organizations with a mission to educate Vermonters about outdoor recreation, strengthen Vermont's outdoor industry, and cultivate a skilled workforce in our urban and rural communities. With state funding in 2024 and '25, VOBO worked with industry experts to develop and instruct professional development workshops and credentials in technical occupations that I mentioned, trail building, bike mechanics, and ski technicians. We delivered 19 multi day courses involving 140 professionals, of which 23% were women, BIPOC, or LGBTQ community members. And these courses ultimately benefited 70 employers and led to job placements and career advancement for those who attended. One success success story is of Aaron Vostel who used four of Voba's bike trainings to go from an entry level mechanic to part time manager at outdoor gear exchanges, riding outpost in Madbush Falls. Another good example would be Alec Ellsworth of Montpelier Parks, who credits the Vogtle Trail trainings as readying his staff to better be able to handle flood mitigation and clean up after severe windstorms. VOBA also co developed a sustainable trail building certificate at Vermont State University, Linden and utilized the Randolph and Killington campuses for workshops forging a promising collaboration in the future. And we've developed a career pathways portal on Vova's website with job board web web pages and career spotlight videos, which draw job seekers and serves as a resource for career navigators, which includes CTE coordinators. Linden Institute has a leading example of an outdoor recreation CTE program in which students learn about outdoor occupations, businesses, and organizations that thrive in our state and the related skills of preparedness, safety, emergency management, required certifications, and educational pathways to find a career in the industry. And a a key portion of their program is Project Bike Tech, which is a nonprofit organization that provides an accredited high school elective program that teaches bike and ebike mechanic skills, career building skills, and integrates common core and STEM elements into their coursework. Vermont is a strategic focus for Project Bike Tech's expansion plans with four schools already operating programs in the state and a strong emphasis on green communities and sustainable economic development. Vermont's workforce goals are closely aligned with the macro trends and values that guide Project Bike Tech's mission. In the last five years, Project Bike Tech has served over 200 Vermont students. And some feedback that they have heard from their partner schools have identified two persistent structural challenges that affect program launch and continuity. First of which are the startup costs associated with establishing new technical education programs. It's difficult for many of the schools to support amid the tight budget environments. And second is teacher turnover combined with limited succession planning, which creates continuity risks when instructors move to other schools and transition into different roles. This year, VOBA's program expands again into a climate resilient workforce partnership with the Climate Action Office, with the Department of Labor, Office of Workforce Strategy and Development, and Vermont Outdoor Recreation Economic Collaborative. It's the project is called the Climate Outdoor Workforce Initiative or the CAWI, and it's designed to understand which jobs in the industry are critical for Vermont's businesses and communities to address climate adaptation and resilience, then sync those jobs with industry education and service based learning opportunities. Right now, we're in the research phase of the CAWI, so it's still early, but I can give two strong examples that we're hearing. One is trail builders. When trail builders are trained and educated with the best management practices for handling high volume precipitation events, there are fewer trail closures when we have flooding. And instead of telling customers to cancel their lodging and dining reservations, communities that are dependent on those trails can say they're still open for business. Another good example of a climate outdoor job is bike mechanics. As Vermont experiences shifts in seasonal weather patterns, ski resorts and service shops are adapting their business model to bring in four season revenue with biking infrastructure, services. In in order to implement implement that climate adaptation strategy and meet the burgeoning bike service demand, mechanics are of critical importance. CTE can play a role in helping prepare our workforce to fill these climate outdoor jobs. Now we know these jobs are growing in demand and professionalization requires skills, knowledge, and hands on learning that CTE and work based learning can uniquely deliver. As the committee continues its work to align the education system with the state's goals, I encourage you to consider expanding funding and curriculums for the state's CTE system in areas that feed specifically into the outdoor industry. It's natural natural resources, outdoor recreation, trail construction, manufacturing, outdoor products, and services like guiding are a few examples in order to foster career exploration and readiness that's accessible for all Vermonters. That's all I have. Thank you very much for having me, and I'm happy to take any questions if you'd like me to.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Well, I'll just start with a quick comment. What you said about your training using CTDs and training people for the outdoor recreation industry is obvious, but it hadn't quite occurred to me. So thank you for doing it makes total sense. It is in fact obvious but I hadn't put my finger on it. So that's very helpful the way you framed it. Glad to hear. I'll say that.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: One of the participants in our CTE work group runs the Moose a Loomoo program. Mhmm. You know? So we wanna make sure it's everywhere. We want Moose Loomoos all over the state too and access in case you call.

[Sen. Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member)]: It's

[Speaker 0]: well, I'll get it in.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: It's great. Great.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Yeah. Well,

[Speaker 0]: I know Addison. It's like an outdoor education program out of Otter Valley.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Oh, okay.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Any questions before we want to run that some? Well, thank you, and you're welcome just to stay on and listen to your Good Patriot. Thank

[Brian Lamoreaux (Green Mountain Sustainability Consulting; VOBA)]: you. I'll hop off and tune into the live link. Appreciate it.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: It's Carson. What do you want me to tell? Yeah. Prepare to get grilled.

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Oh, boy. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Carson Zumbalo. I'm currently a student at Vermont Saint Louis University of Linden. This upcoming spring, I'll be graduating with a degree in Outdoor Education Leadership in tourism. Thank you so much for this opportunity to have me here share my educational pathway. Has shaped my interest and skills in outdoor recreation. I would say that I'm a manor by blood, but I'm reminded by heart. I was fortunate enough to attend a career and technical education program in my hometown of Farmer Macphain where I focus on outdoor education leadership. That program gave me early access and exposure to careers in the outdoor industry and helped me to find fundamental skills such as communication and teamwork and leadership that can be applied to any job. I never was one to sit still and be able to take in information. I'm much more of a person I used to do rather than listen. And that's because for most people in my generation, if you haven't noticed. Through this CTE program, I learned a wide range of outdoor and technical skills, many of which were taught by local industry experts. This program is also called OXPO Outdoors. For those who are unfamiliar, an oXPO is a bend in a river where it changes directions and resembles the letter U. This became our program's motto, OXPO Outdoors, a place where learning changes directions. Like many students in this generation, I've never learned well from sitting still, like I said earlier. This program gave me exactly what I needed, an opportunity to learn by doing and to develop practical, transferable skills in an outdoor setting. My passion for the outdoors ultimately led me to enroll at Vermont State University, which is widely recognized for its Outdoor Education Leadership and Tourism program. UCSU builds directly on the foundation that CTE programs provide, reinforcing both technical and professional skills such as communication, leadership, teamwork, and time management, which are all applicable to any occupation, as I said earlier. BTSU's Outdoor Education Program is closely aligned with the needs of Vermont's outdoor economy. This alignment is reflected in the job placement rates between ninety five and one hundred percent following graduation. Many graduates remain in Vermont working for organizations such as the Vermont Youth Conservation Corps, Green Mountain Club, and numerous style and operation positions. Both my CTE program and VTSU also integrate industry recognized professional certifications to their curriculum. These credentials are critical for emerging professionals as they demonstrate readiness for employment and help bridge the gap between education and the workforce. As I completed my degree this spring, I'll be doing independent contract work for Vermont Estimate Trail Association, along with an internship at the National Center for Outdoor Adventure, National Center for Outdoor and Adventure Education and various other professional development opportunities. This opportunity would not have been possible without the education, certifications, professional connections that I have gained through CTE and higher education programs like the ones I've described. Beyond my education, I remain involved with CTE from another perspective. After graduating high school, I served on the advisory committee for my former outdoor education leadership program. I've returned to speak with current students about careers in the outdoors how the skills they're learning can be applied beyond high school. The impacts of these programs is not limited to my experience. Out of 14 students in my 2022 to 2023 CEP cohort, eight are currently working in outdoor industry roles positions including, but not limited to truckers, summit stewards, map and route operations. These are real jobs that support local economies, keep young people connected to the areas they're about. I applaud the efforts of this committee and others working to strengthen career pathways for Vermont students and adults who want to live and work here. This bill is particularly promising because it recognizes CTE as a bridge from education to employment and or continued education. Rather than a side option, I experienced this firsthand. CTE programs help students pass their interest with career career exploration. In a state like Vermont, where the outdoor industry is a major economic driver, I encourage continued efforts to expand CTE. These programs are essential to maintaining a strong local pipeline from education to employment. As my professor Brad Mossbeth said, students coming from these technical high schools show themselves being more dedicated, experienced, and prepared to succeed in both the workplace and higher education programs. Thanks for your work to support student success. I'm happy to answer any questions. Yes. Kirsten, so you're, like yourself, like to

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: be outside and doing. This has been a huge change for me, sit here and listen. So when it comes to the academic side where you had to sit in class, how hard did you find that? Did you just self control saying, I know what my goal is and use that to guide you when you had to be sitting in a classroom?

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yeah, that's a great question. I think much like all of you, I was very privileged to grow up surrounded by nature. And I've kind of, I think nature itself teaches me a lot about self discipline and time management. I've never found academics especially challenging, but I think what I've excelled in is working in

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: the outdoors. Okay, so the

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: classroom didn't bother you, it had to stay in there.

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: I never was a fan of it, but I always retained a lot more information and took a lot more value out of opportunities that took place outside of hands on.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So anybody else? So talk to us a little bit more about you, what you're doing with this coming summer? This spring, I am pursuing

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: some professional development opportunities. So I'll be doing some independent contracted work for Vermont Hinsdale Association coming up. Yeah. And then I'll be heading down to North Carolina doing some church up later in

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: the spring before coming back to Rancho. Okay. What are you looking to do? Have you thought about it?

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: I think long term, I would It's okay if you do that. Well, that's a great question. It's something I

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: If my answer would have been, I'm not, don't know. Go ahead.

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: I've definitely thought a lot about it. At least until I'm off my parents' insurance, I wanted to work seasonally and get a lot more experience in the outdoors working with different diverse groups of people. Pipeline dream right now is I want to manage an organization that gives opportunities to other people and to to get outside through conservation work. Sorry.

[Speaker 0]: This is professor.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Great, thank you. Thank you all. We only had two of you listed. We have a few more minutes if anybody wants to add anything. Yeah, well, sure. You can just go home. Yeah. Switch the industry. Great, okay.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Guess I

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: don't really plan. Have an act a couple minutes, so just

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Great. Thank you so much for your work on this important committee. Thanks. I'm Brad Moskowitz. I live in Waterbury Center, so just up the road. I've been in Vermont since 1999, when I moved here to accept a job as a professor of outdoor education at what was then Johnson State College. I was at Johnson for about twenty three years, and then there was some, you know, a little upheaval, some changes within the state college system, and then some more changes, and now I'm teaching on the Linden campus, where I have incredible students like Carson Brian, who was talking earlier, an alumni of that program as well. We prepare the future folks, the other people that are here for Outdoor Recreation Day at the State House. We try, we give both technical training, credentials, technical skills for students to go on and be lift mechanics at the resorts, to be rock climbing, ice climbing, ski guides in Vermont, in New Hampshire, in Europe, all across the world. It's an incredible program that has been life changing for many students who have participated in it, and I think it's critically important that people know about opportunities like our program, like the Musa Lammu program, and Kamari is one of our students who went through that program right now, people like Carson who have these opportunities in high school to recognize that outdoor industry, outdoor education, adventure based learning, experiential learning are all critical components to human growth and development. And that if they understand in high school that there are actually both jobs and professions that they can move directly into, or go further their education at universities and colleges such as Vermont State University of London, that there is a place for them to be active, constructive members of society contributing to a better work? That's great. First question, I got one too.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: Great. So obviously the higher ed portion of outdoor recreation careers is mature. Sure, well. It is, There's and there's a lot of number of years.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yeah, yeah.

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: So what I'm not sure, I know I don't understand, maybe my colleagues don't, at the CTE level, the high schools, are there programs in the state? And if so, what do they look like? Like, how could you characterize them? And if not, what would a program like that look like?

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yeah, that's a great question. And I would say I'm not aware of a lot other than the Linden Institute program, which is right down the hill from us, and we have actually a strategic partnership, an MOU with them to try to create connections. We've had a few students come from Linden Institute up into our program directly and be very successful. The Musalumu program, that representative, or senator, sorry, Hinsdale referenced earlier, I've got a student, an awesome young woman, from that program right now. I don't know the details. Carson might be able to answer that question more effectively. There is another program in Maine, not the one Carson went to, but it's in Rockport.

[Carson Zumbalo (Student, Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yeah, Camden, Rockport area.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Camden, Rockport. And we have currently three students in our program who came directly from there. These under, undergraduate, sorry, high school programs are introducing students to the careers, the opportunities, the professions that exist, and provides them an introduction to some of the skills, the talents, the both the technical and the soft skills of leadership facilitation, they're getting introduced to that at the high school level, and that comes in different formats. I know that the Camden Rocklin program in Maine would be a great one to actually examine and use as a template. I know I've heard good things about the Goose Loom program, but it involves teaching skills, providing structured outdoor experiences, and then helping students understand what the pathways are.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Good, thanks. Tigal, to you, I think it's really interesting that we have the the stakeholder system, we are carving out a niche for ourselves perhaps as compared to what others are doing. And my question is do you have, within your program, you have a lot of kids coming to the college just for your program?

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yes and no. And from out of state.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: Who know about it so long because that's what I want to do. That's what I want to

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Yeah, so just a quick history. At Johnson in around the mid 2000s, our major was the largest or second largest major on campus and had over 100 students. At Linden, at their program, with them, they had over 120 students, probably about twelve or fifteen years ago. Since then, things have dramatically changed. Since everything that happened, I don't know if you were serving during the time of Diablo. Yes. Yeah. A lot of strange things went down. Long story short, we are in a rebuilding phase. We probably have about 50 majors on our campus right now, which is more than we had two years ago, but a lot less historically had. And the big problem is number one, main recognition's gone. The Linden program started fifty two years ago through a unique partnership with ski resorts and higher education. And I can throw a stone at probably any worker at one of the ski resorts around here, and they know somebody that graduated from Linden, if not the manager. So the answer is, we need to get the word out. There are Vermonters who don't know about our program whose sons, daughters, kids would love this made up, they don't know about it.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Well, for not being prepped. No doubt. So

[Ted Gates (Senior Fiscal Analyst, VT Agency of Education)]: oh, yeah. And, oh, by

[Sen. David Weeks (Vice Chair)]: the way, Vermont State University, I've noticed, as I'm watching, nightly news these days, has got a, rather, heavy media presence. And I can tell you I've never seen any any video content related to mountain manager or outdoor recreation. It's all kind of psychedelic. It's all generic. Yes. Right. Feed that doctor. Can

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: somebody record that? It'll a recording, right? It'll

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: be great. Thank you for that comment.

[Sen. Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Appreciate it.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Anything else? No, but thank

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: you all for coming.

[Prof. Brad Moskowitz (Vermont State University–Lyndon)]: Thank you, Bob. Appreciate your service.

[Dr. Erin Davis (Chief Academic Officer, VT Agency of Education)]: Thanks, Bob. Thank you.

[Sen. Seth Bongartz (Chair)]: So why don't we take a five minute break and do that here at 305 for the

[Speaker 0]: last