Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: You're alive.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Good afternoon. This is the Senate Education Committee at the Canaan Elementary through High School. We are back after a break. We met this morning with a student and we're here this afternoon with a teacher panel. And this sort of recap for people who might be watching on YouTube, who didn't see the first part, we're visiting, we have tried to get out during the session in the past to visit schools, and the session gets so hectic that there's no way that we I gave We tried to go to the Montpelier High School, but we could see from where we are in the middle. So we have realized that we're going get out of the schools when we're not in session, and we are, this is the first of five stops, we're going to visit five districts, and just, they're somewhat, you know, they're different, and just really get a feel from students, teachers, principals, and then members of the public for what's going on in their area, what the opportunities are, what the challenges are, and to frame it, we are operating under the rubric of these hearings. It's about how we present for every student in Vermont an excellent educational opportunity. That's what we're trying to do. And then we're exploring that topic in different settings. If there's a school in Vermont that is small by necessity, as the term is used, it's Canaan, I suspect. And so that's why we're here. Also because you're in the far reaches, it is a place that we want to try to get into far reaches a little bit as well. So I'm Seth Bongartz, I'm the chair of the Senate Education Committee on my left here.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale, Chittenden County, and the Senate Majority Leader, and have been holding some CTE work meetings before session, so I'm gonna keep getting your brain up.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Senator Heffernan from Addison County District and very impressed with the school so far you guys are doing a great job can say say how from your kids have said.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: I'm Terry Williams Steiner from Rutland County, I live in Holtley which is on the New York State border and I'm happy to be here.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: So we asked kids this morning about I don't know what they liked about their school, we tried to draw out of them, what opportunities they wish they had had, but they didn't. And actually, they just came up with, they felt like they were really getting a real range of opportunities, not just in school, but after school, and all of the clubs and teams and everything. So it's really very impressive to listen to them. And so when we're in session, we tend to hear from superintendents, and so we're trying to, we want to hear from people on the ground and so you're in a small, very rural setting here, a small school, and so we just wanted to explore with you and I know, I think that Ryan has set this up with you a little bit, within that framework of providing excellent educational opportunity for everyone, child, what are the opportunities or the challenges that you face in this setting, opportunities that derive from this setting, and just some of the things that you're doing, whether, and my guess is that sometimes there's things going on that are even individualized, individual teachers doing things beyond what the systemic program may be, but we just want to hear about that, what you're doing to help the whole system deliver excellent educational opportunity for everyone in the world. Carry on. Introduce themselves first. Well, as you go down the line or wherever, just each time you do it, just introduce your name and what exactly what town you live in. Do that in case it's group of people, what town you live in. So I don't know how

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: you want to do it. From what you teach, maybe.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Oh, yeah, no, we do that. Yeah. Just tell us a little bit about what you do here and try to get into what I was trying to set up there. And then you can start however you want to move from wherever you want to start.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Everybody's looking at you. Thanks for answering my question. So

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: my name is Megan Primo. I've just started my seventeenth year here. My primary role here is the school nurse, but I do wear a lot of hats. I'm the student council advisor. I am the coordinator for after school and summer programming, staff wellness. And I am also a co coordinator for our EST plans. So the MTSS, our educational support teams. I'll

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: No, go ahead. You want me

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: to go? Just spend

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: a few minutes, spend a couple minutes and just, well, you pick what you want to talk to us about, but I'm interested in after school and summer as much along with everything else, but just make sure you hit those.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Okay, so I'm

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: going to start with the nursing part if you don't mind.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Yeah, sure.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Challenge wise is that we are very remote as I'm sure you saw as you drove here. So our resources are limited, know, if people need services, they're driving all the way to Newport. Mental health especially is lacking. We are very fortunate we have mental health resources and actually clinicians in our building. But if families needed work outside of that, they're looking at traveling all the way to Newport for that. Know, enrolling in NECA or WIC or needing, you know, more intense services, again, it's all the way to Newport. That's a huge drive when you're dealing with families who already have so many barriers, financial transportation, etc. So from a challenge perspective, I would say that is a huge challenge medical wise. At the same time on a positive I really try to find resources and collaboration. I think we just did our seventh year collaborating with Island Pond Health Center. I have a dental program with them they come here we have 30 students that

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: are enrolled in the program.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Came What a

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: dental program? Dental? Dental sorry.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Have your digital.

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: My apologies

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: We're both veterans. Yeah, very unfair.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Thank you for confirming. The Island Pond Health Centre is

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: a federally qualified health centre. So, they do need to do some outreach. They come here once a year and do education grades pre k through eight. They come once and then they come and actually do cleaning. They bring the chair, the whole thing they're here and then we go once a year we take a bus with all 30 students. They go there get a cleaning again get an x-ray of their teeth, and see the dentist and get work, whether it be teeth pulled, fillings, whatever it may be. So that has continued to grow. Every year we get more and more students in it. We do they accept insurance, have a sliding fee scale. So I assist families to and if they don't have insurance, connect them with an outreach provider to get them medic to try to apply for the Medicaid funding. So those are some positives here, you know, relationship building and trying to find resources in a creative way because they don't just there's not an overabundance of options, you know, so that is a definite positive to a challenge.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Sure. Bennington, you showed us the problem, you have maybe an idea for an

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: answer for the problem as far as like

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: going having to go to Newport. Is there a solution that we could look at to because Newport is your closest hospital, correct?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: There is a hospital in New Hampshire that is fifteen minutes away, but as far as mental health goes, no mental health agencies in New Hampshire will accept Vermont Medicaid and Vermont insurance.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: So that's something we could work through?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: You could try. We've tried before but yes you could certainly try. Right ten minutes down the road is Northern Human Services it is called which is similar to Vermont's is considered North Northeast Kingdom Human Services. So they are at the equivalent of the two. And there has been it before trying to get them to work together. I don't really know what the challenges are, but I know that Vermont doesn't see New Hampshire, New Hampshire doesn't see Vermont. I don't know what the reasoning is, but I know that's been

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: an ongoing problem for years. At least you give us something to work on. Yeah, thanks.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: I do

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: you have you sought community schools funding for like an on-site family counselor or something

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: like that? We do have a community schools grant. Okay. That's what you're in reference We do have two counselors here who are full. Yeah, yeah, yep, they

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: are full. So they're paid for with the community schools? Or once they're

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: don't know who pays for that. You'd have to ask. Part of it is paid out of, I believe, our CFP. We use part of our CFP funds this year to do that. Part of it comes out of Medicaid funds. And those are for this current year. Those are the main funding sources prior to that. It was some of the grants we use prior to that shift.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: So that's from a nursing sample would be the things that I would touch upon the biggest for challenges and resources and pediatricians too. Mean, you're talking Newport, there is a pediatrician who comes to Colburn once a week, But that is, know, also, that's a limitation. Things are just different. You don't have, if you're looking at going to a specialty, you're looking at UVM, or you're looking at Dartmouth in Lebanon. So, it's just, we have to, we use what we have essentially.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: It sounds like you're really working with families as much as it's

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Yes, very close. Relationship building is huge. It's because it's imperative because we I try very hard to work with them to get what their children need to be successful because if they're healthy they're going to be successful academically there's a you know I believe strongly there's a huge tie between the two. You know in little things you know we right now the student council has a snack drive going because we have lots of kids every day we do not come school with snacks you know food security is a very huge thing here we had a grant that we I don't know which grant it was, but we lost a grant that did the backpack program. We used to last year we had 77 students here that were a part of that program. They got extra food. So food is a huge problem.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: And that's going from not doing backpack?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: No, we lost that funding. I don't know what funding that was that paid for that. Again, I'm gonna, I don't remember, but last year it

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: was pieced together so we could do it for one more year through a couple of local troops and then I don't even remember what was before that.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: And we do have our fresh fruit or vegetable of the day that helps us.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: We do have that, yes.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Any interaction with our Canadian students or affiliated with any organizations over there on the other side of border?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: I can't think of anything across the

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: border in Canada, no. A lot with New

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: A lot with New Hampshire. Right, because we get students after eighth grade in Stewartstown can choose to come here as one of their high schools and we have a lot of collaboration with our sports teams due to sizes and so there is a combo team Pittsburgh and Stewartstown

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: are part of Cadence although there

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: is we have other students. For our after school program, that hat that I wear for summer and after school, we have two different, three different grants that we use to fund that. We incredibly grown this year, thankfully to Act 78, we received a center and a program grant. And we operate four days a week, Monday through Thursday for after school programming. We have 74 students enrolled in that program. That runs from three to 04:30. It is open to students in grades one through 12. We survey the students of what they were interested in to try to increase the program's availability to increase interest, which definitely made a huge difference because last year it was more like grade you're either in grade one through three and you're seeing after school year four through six. We have a wide variety of activities which has totally raised our numbers of students.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Talk to us a little bit about what some of those are.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: We have had Taekwondo martial arts, we have cooking groups, we have outdoor play, we have girls on the run, we have a actually have a fleet of bikes, we have a biking group. Help me, book club. We have a White Mountain Science Center out of Littleton that is coming to do woodwork We have woodworking drama. We have two plays that are going be upcoming.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: And are you able to draw into those after school activities the kids who will really benefit from them the most?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Oh most definitely yes yes. And then the summer program we run four weeks Monday through Thursday full days We also will be doing an adventure camp which is a two week off-site hopefully at Siskim Moriarty camp in Derby. We've used them in the past and they can do things from archery, swimming, kayaking, ropes course. It's a wonderful program. Siskin is actually part of our after school program also arts and crafts. I feel like I'm missing some other things but

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Is that

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: a day thing or they stay overnight now?

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Day thing, bus, yes. At four weeks here is our program here. We have reading and math intervention, PT and OT come once a week, they still receive their speech services, special ed is here for the ESY services. It's theme based last year I don't remember our numbers.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: We heard about some this morning.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: But we have a large group of

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: large group of kids that attend that as well

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Which is a you know huge benefit to the student and to the children. I prior to my work here I used to do some outreach stuff and I love the search institute's developmental assets framework. I'm not sure if you're familiar with that. It's thirty years research based of providing internal and external assets. So that is the framework that we often utilize when we're thinking about our after school and summer programs.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Thank you. Sure if I missed anything.

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: So my name is Kevin Falls. I am the middle school and high school social studies teacher here. And I'm also rebooting the National Honor Society for the school. Unfortunately, last year, we weren't able to utilize that program. But this year, we're hoping to turn that around and get some kids involved. I can tell you that, you know, I've only been teaching now for three years total and only two years in Canaan. And one of the things that I see most about all these kids is that they are very isolated. Their knowledge about the greater world is limited because of the location. Some have not even been out of New England. So when we myself and my colleague in the English department, we have been trying to do a better job of planning, getting these kids down to Boston or even further. A lot of times this is utilizing grant funds, specifically through the Tillerson Center, and a couple of other entities that offer the money. And, you know, I know that the kids really appreciate it, they get very excited because it's something completely new to them. And it's something that they can experience. Being up here, one of the greatest challenges is that these kids being in Canaan is challenging for them because if their friends aren't in Canaan, they're in New Hampshire. And bridging that gap is very, very difficult. You know, with especially with like our CTE programs, they it used to be that we would utilize one another. And unfortunately, we can't any, like not to the extent why it's like it was it's because of the state lines correct?

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Well law.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah, we're I think with CTE though we're still able to share. Share to an extent correct because

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: CTE can still share, but it's sharing students in general, they can't cross the border.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Right.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: For Vermont statute, don't ask me which one I just know that.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: But that's a barrier. Where we used to say the only foreign language teacher was in Colbrook, the kids would take afternoon or morning classes in Colbrook. They'd take a bus from here down there to take those classes or some students say they weren't, they didn't have a math teacher at the moment, they will come here and take our math courses, but they're not switching schools anymore.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: When did that end? Was in the last five years. Five

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: years, I'd

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: say, yeah.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: It was happening pretty, but we had actually an amazing program. Yeah. And the sharing and

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Bring then your medals and then you stack it.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: No, this is really interesting here.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Yeah, that was one of my main thing is that we used to be able to do a lot of shared resources.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Yeah.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: With staff or programs because CTE we only offer a few here but there was a mechanic mechanics. Yeah,

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: I mean, I will say too, I think to our benefit, I think we actually had more students coming to Yeah,

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: When we have Running Start we had a lot of kids come for Running Start but then do they cap Running Start? I forget now that I'm not in the high school anymore. No they didn't. They were gonna I thought they were talked about if you didn't have so many students in it.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Right and I believe we had the teachers with the expertise to do those things similar to CTE we had the teachers with the certification. So whatever is

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: going on there truly really limiting opportunities for kids on both Yeah, sides of

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: your core academic and the other like hands on. Yeah, took your woodshop teacher and I'm like this is a great woodshop and now the New Hampshire kids can't come to this woodshop.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah, okay.

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: And I think that's kind of that's where I was going with it was we, you know, for us, the other Vermont schools just so far away for Newport, it's really unrealistic for these kids. But if we could re look into that, because Colbrook's fifteen minutes away, Pittsburgh's fifteen minutes away. And these kids, they know each other, the community up here isn't that state line is nothing for us. Because Some

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: of the Canadian people there's not a yeah, there's a there's an actual international border there, yeah.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Okay.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: And also some of the high schoolers drive to were driving to those classes and it's a lot safer to drive fifteen minutes than in the wintertime. Did we've had students go to the CTE center in my North Country. Yep. But the wintertime.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: That's on the Hampshire side,

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: it did not happen on the Hampshire side. It's the Vermont statute that is Yes.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: I heard both, that it's somehow, and it was, but heard down the Woodshop. No. The New Hampshire site.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Well, think that this superintendent kind of wrote us a letter. Okay. And I think it was that.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Since we it's also yeah, it's also a situation of where, you know, they're not excited about sending sending their students here. So, you know, in the end, who's really sorry? Yeah. Know. Yeah.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Okay. Oh, you're good.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Okay, Melissa Norsworthy. I'm currently a kindergarten teacher. I've been teaching here for eighteen years. I first started as a family consumer science and health teacher. I've taught various levels in the elementary. Some of the things that we do great is a lot of us wear many hats, so that way we can give kids opportunities. It can be challenging because we're low staff and, you know, burnout. Just thinking of funding issues too, our OT now has gone down to one day a week. And if it, you know, have school stay on Mondays, I don't know if she's making them up.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: And OT? Occupational therapists.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: We hire out and they were coming to one and a half days now they're down to one. And in the past, for kindergarten and preschool, I would have her come in and do a whole group to help with the OT skills, you know, and now we can't even do that just so that way not kind of be preventative or help with their skills right off instead of being three years down the road. Oh, they really are having trouble with these fine motor skills. Yeah, either like funding, which causes low staffing, which impacts other things, but we try to do what we can with wearing multiple hats. One of the best things, we were combined in the elementary, a different grade. That was a struggle because I even taught when you're a combined one, two, and you're never giving the students everything that they need, because you are splitting that math time already between two grades. But this year, we finally have split up and all grades have just one teacher. So that's been

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: I think also kind of to emphasize like about like, when I was looking at like the minimum class sizes and things like that, up here, I know I cannot remember the percentage of IEP kids and trauma based kids that we have. But it's a significant amount. And we, you know, when we differentiate and we have to teach to, you know, those kids that are in academia that they are brilliant. But then we also have to teach to some kids that are in the eighth grade that can barely read. That can really put a lot of strain on us. And sometimes with the sizes, it really helps because they those kids can really get the actual attention that they deserve. I don't know if you guys feel the same, but

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Yeah, we used, I used to have, Kettering used to have a classroom pair out full classroom just because of safety and their lack of independence. I haven't had that in five years. And when you're toileting somebody, are you gonna do with the rest of the classroom? And then there's a lot of, I have a pretty big group for behavior issues, and that is just me trying to get one fell down.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: And then we go to put out this fire, that one started back up. So that's hard too. But one of the other positive things to give kids more opportunities when we were in the high school, especially we collaborate across disciplines to try to intermix them.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Create projects and we do have are we still doing internships up here? The kid used to have the opportunity because of the local businesses. We're very open to having students school to work.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah, yeah, still goes that

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: way they weren't directly involved in a CTE program they still could explore that field. That was great.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: So you're officially a CTE center here? Yes. So if you were to send your students to a CTE where's the closest school? An hour an hour?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: A little over an hour.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: How many years? Eighteen.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Are you a tuitioning school? Does Canaan tuition their students out or do you receive tuition students?

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: We received tuition, yes, okay.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Sort down, they only have preschool through eighth grade and at eighth grade they have school choice whether it's a New Hampshire school or come here. And then we have also the Choice District that can. Any K Choice

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: has the option to come here.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Yeah, and do you gain a lot of kids from any K Choice?

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: I think our numbers right now for the current school year are about 15.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Okay, for high school?

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: I don't know if that's all.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: That's like 85% of the

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Any K Choice has about two ninety kids in

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: any kid choices also huge and most of kids work far away

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: yeah right so a lot of the kids that come here are from like North and over because we're the closest and from Brunswick North usually Brunswick, Bloomfield, Bloomington, lot of we get a lot of those kids here because those are the closest we also have buses that go in both those directions.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: So the parents really looking at which school is the closest?

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Oh yeah, think a lot of it for the NEK choice is definitely that because they have to get their kids there. So I think a lot of times people choose maybe if they work in a particular town, choose a school that's in that town because it's convenient for them if that's where the parent works because you do have to provide transportation.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: So you're a kindergarten teacher?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Yes.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: But now I know you've gone to others. When kids come to you, do you find that they are where you would hope they would be, or is a lot of what you're doing trying to bring kids up to the level that you wish they were entering?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: That's correct. Every year it seems like they come in with fewer and fewer skills and more and more behavior issues. Yes, and well, and I also speech, speech is actually a huge thing and I think it's because this is the COVID babies. Either they were masked or their parents are behind a screen so you cannot watch the mouth being formed when they're doing sounds so we have a lot of kids that have

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: And to a of kids who you get have they not had access to child, to day care or child childhood or early childhood?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: No, they do. They can come to preschool here starting at age three.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Starting at age three, okay. Yeah.

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: There is a general lack of care.

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: There's only one daycare, and that's in Coalbrook, where it's basically in the backcountry.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: So I don't know who to answer with this, when you have kids that come in like that, you've had them for a year, how do you, as a school, what are the things you do to try and, like, the time you're in eighth grade, get to where they need to be, or maybe by the time you're in sixth grade and ready to go to middle school? How you do that?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Well, we try our best. We meet them where they're at. We have intervention who's trying to help out. We try to figure out programs. We've instilled socio emotional programs PBIS? To help PBIS, we've been at the school now for a couple of years.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: What is that?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Positive behavior intervention systems. Okay.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Some sort of interventionalists?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Yeah. Who also have a shared hat because sometimes they teach middle school or high school. Okay. So sometimes they're not available full time. They can get who they can get.

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: Generally, think our intervention is very brief. So I have kids leaving the room for fifteen minutes once a week to try to get them up to several reading levels. It's like one teacher taking one class time and trying to fit everybody who needs her in. So I feel like there's probably not enough intervention.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: So that's a place where you're resource challenged.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Yes, it's funding, yeah.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: But we also but it's kind of under the umbrella is also MTSS kind of the same thing. Multi tiered.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: Yeah, but that's before they get well that some of the intervention.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Correct. Okay.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: But

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: and special ed. The pre kindergarten through second or third grade special educator only works three days a week. So you also have a shortened time.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Is that because of funding?

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: I'm not entirely sure. I think it's maybe funding but also being able to find somebody who's qualified willing to come and stay here. She actually is a woman who was in retirement. She's phenomenal. So she came out of retirement for us. Yeah, people can come, you know, know previously, we've been looking for when I

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: first started full time interventionists, and we couldn't even get anybody to

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: there's a downside of a small community,

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: you know, so then people would be like, well, can take it up during my prep, sir, you're qualified to do it here qualified, you know, we've had a handful of, you know, retired teachers come back in and work for a period of time, a couple days a week just to try to help out. And it's the same situation with our current interventionist is they're picking up the pieces in between their regular schedule to try to do what's best for the kids.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: And personally speaking, intervention is usually grant funded. So you never know from one year to the next if you're really going to have that position. It can be kind of scary for somebody who wants to settle Right, and still grant funded.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Because again, don't have the resources, you know, if we had to put the amount we get in grants into the general budget I mean it's already hard now never mind adding.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: And previously we used to have to write our own grant the last couple years we finally have a grant a person who's wearing many hats

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: one of it is a grant. A grant letter for the school, okay. And

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: to just tap on to something that Melissa said, so our after school and summer program is the only option. So we are, because we are so small, it's not like parents have like a YMCA or rec centers to choose for like this is it.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Yeah. To be

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: very clear that there's not. A boys call for Right, this is this is the only option and daycare the closest actual daycare that you would call a daycare is in Colbrook they are awful everything here is in home care which you know it's you know a mom staying home with her own kids has a very small number of kids she can see anyway So if kids aren't here after school, they're either with a family member or an older sibling or home alone.

[Melissa Norsworthy (Kindergarten Teacher, Canaan Schools)]: And our after school in Sao Jorge is free. If they were to do the summer program in Colbrook, it

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: costs a lot of money because you're not a resident.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: So one of the potentially good things with the after school summer is that you get the full social range of socioeconomics of kids which you might not if you had ironically. Okay. Yes.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: We do

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: use again the great thing I think about a K-twelve school is we do it is great to use older students with younger students. Is huge thing and we've actually added an after school program called Helping Hands which older kids can choose to take part in a day and they're just in groups with the younger kids helping out and it just it's a beautiful thing honestly to see we just is so that's been really great too. And it provides some of them their key club members, so it provides them community service hours at the same time.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: That was my bias in that question. I would think you could take good readers of any age and help kids who aren't able to read well. That's kind of what I did in LA with kids who didn't speak English. And it was great for me, you know, so we've seen so much community among the kids. I think good readers just go one on one with kids who are struggling and help them.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Part of

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: that is scheduling. Being able to align the older kids at school, the ones that are more capable to be paired with the younger ones. And also kind of doing a little training with them so they know what they need

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: to do. But you do use some

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: of that anywhere with your DDI groups, correct?

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Yeah. Well, they're actually teacher led.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Let's make sure we get through everybody. We should keep

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Can we skip

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: over to Amy real quick?

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: I've got like

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: ten minutes to my next class. I'm a K-twelve art teacher. This is my thirtieth year here, so I'm really old. And I also do the new teacher mentoring program, try to keep people here. And I do grade level two meetings, and I'm a class advisor. I'm also a parent. I think that as a small school, we do a really good job of figuring out what kids need and trying our best to get it for them. Case in point is that my daughter wanted to take Korean this year and Vermont Virtual Learning, whatever it is, BLACs, does not have Korean. So, we found a spot, school agreed to let her take it, place out of California. Long story short, that's just one example of our school providing things for kids. I do know that there is a small pot of money for kids who want to do these extra things, like go to Governors Institute in the summer or take part in, you know, other summer programs. There's a limited pot of money for that, and perhaps if there was more, we could get other kids involved in sort of out of, whether it's virtual, online, or through field trip. The field trip thing is really kind of cut in. We haven't had field trips for the last year or two. That money's just been cut. So, taking kids to Boston, to the Boston Museum of Art and to see a performing, I usually try to work in a performing art event to that, gone. And so, I think a lot of teachers are feeling sort of stifled by that, and then just having the kids have that opportunity to get out of Dodge and see something that they haven't seen before. One year it was an Indian sitar player,

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: and I

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: thought, oh my goodness, what are these kids going to think of that? But it was such an odd experience that Boston Museum told the performer that we were there as a school, they mentioned us, you see the kids light up, and they were so engaged in that, when most of them really just like come to music or whatever it is, you know. So, those experiences I think are really, really important for

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: our And

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: that was for

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: the whole class? It wasn't

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: No, all the think that generally I take my classes first. Yeah. But then there's usually room on the bus. So you take anybody who will

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: want to. Yeah.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: I'm sorry, didn't catch your name. Amy Keeper. Yes.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Well, I may have missed it, you have pre k here too? Yeah. Pre k is. Overall.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: And that's all full day

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: pre k.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: My name is Todd Nichols and I've been teaching here for twenty five years. I've been working with kids in some capacity educationally for over thirty years, thirty two years. My role here is the K-twelve physical educator as well as grades seven through 12 CTE for emergency services. I'm focusing on firefighting and emergency medical services. I have page one here of Act 73. And I think this is where I'm going to kind of go with our challenges. It says here that it says the most enduring legacy of Brigham, meaning Brigham versus the state state of Vermont is the state's responsibility to ensure substantially equal educational opportunities for all Vermont students. Now that has resonated with me for decades, because that has been part of education quality standards. And so they're in lies. And you know, in my view, the big challenge for Canadian schools, how do we ensure substantially equal educational opportunities for a school like Canaan? Because I can tell you that, you know, I've been to other schools in different capacities, either visiting because of trainings or visiting because of invites. But anyway, when I when you look at other schools, many other schools, when I take it from the physical education perspective, they have fitness rooms or a weight room, what you've seen, you know, for, you know, years ago, we don't have that. And we haven't had that since I've been here, we currently don't have access to our locker rooms because of ADA compliance. And you know, and, know, you it's nobody's fault. It's just that the building's old. You know, and we don't have a CTE center. But with those challenges, we leverage what we can, what we have. So, you know, what do we leverage? You know, we use our Canyon Community Forest for agriculture CTE. We use local old buildings for building trades and restoration and we have for decades. And for myself, I'm also a first responder in our town or interstate international department. We also serve New Hampshire into Canada. And I've been part of that department for going in twenty two years, which kind of got me to where I am, in addition to doing some physical education stuff for Canyon schools. So I leverage using the fire department, and the 45th Parallel EMS, which is just across the river for classrooms. So we leverage what we can to make it substantially equal as best we can. And I think we talked about this before, teachers here and for my whole ten years so far, teachers have always had multiple endorsements to help our students across almost across the board.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Everyone nodded when you said that and I want to make sure I understand the power of what that means you're getting more credentials to correct help your students correct.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: I have so I have my endorsements are K-twelve is actually pre K-twelve is what the endorsement says. And then I'm also endorsed for CTE grade seven through 12 emergency services.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: And

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: when we and when I've actually had seventh and eighth grade students for CTE like pre tech and I've had some ninth grade pre tech classes. But when the check, you know, with the challenges that come around, it's like, okay, funding can be a challenge. Sometimes numbers is a challenge. I think you heard about that this morning, I talked to one of my students, you know, Riley, And I just got those guys going and doing some doing some of their clinical work out in fire out at

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: the fire station. So those are some challenges. I'm going

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: to speak more from a CT angle, because I see this more of our more and more of our challenges truly lie. And moving forward, you know, this is going to be for you guys to decide. But when you start talking about class size, that really, really puts us in a tough spot here at Canaan Schools, as you can probably see. You know, Canaan, Canaan, in my view, Canaan really does a good job with small class size, we're limited resources, you can see that. And if we're kind of forced to, you know, ham ourselves in with these with these class size rules, that's going to take away from the, you know, the true solid individualized education that we're allowed to afford these students. I'm sure maybe you heard about that from some of the students earlier today. So I see that being a future challenge moving forward, something to think about. And, you know, and as for my own program, I have, you know, we have a dip in students and, and then there's a possible resurgence coming out after a year or so. Well, what does that mean? You know, if you look at numbers, does that mean we're going to, you know, we're going to sunset a program because next year, we don't have enough, but maybe two years from now we do. So those are difficult decisions. And I don't think that you know, I don't think it's quite fair to our students because we're small, you know, to put the additional challenge on us, know, with class size, I know that doesn't exist for CTE currently with the law. But just overall, some things to think about. You might go ahead.

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: One of the things I'd like to emphasize before I was a teacher, I'm as a postmaster, and I heard everything in the North Country. And one of the things that was always said, and this was before I was a teacher, and specifically in Canaan, that across the river, other communities would fight for their kids to come here. And whether it be for Todd's EMS program, or Denise's business program, or just come and study science or history over here. And it, it resonated with me to become a teacher because I saw so many of these individuals, and I still see it now. They know that they don't have the money, so they get trained for it themselves, and they do it themselves. And it resonates in the community, they know it. So, well,

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: So one thing I'm going to try not to get myself in trouble here but one of the things that we haven't really heard a lot about in the plan is the teacher's salaries and but what it sounds like you know if a teacher goes above and beyond or you should have like an additional skill identifier that makes the pay grades equal across the state because they're not and I think that's one of the issues that I have a focus on is that we need to get that educational pay equity in there too. In Act 60 the original plan was good but it just never they never quite got there as far as having the same resources so the schools ended up picking up the slack and the teachers usually are the ones that did it so I applaud you guys for what you're doing here because it's a community school really is. It's across state lines and it's small by necessity but it's small because that's what you are.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: What I'll close with speaking of community for my program is that over the past twelve years that I've been running the program, my program produces local first responders, not every one of them. But at the other end, I you know, it's I like it's how students get their introduction to like medical school and can I do it? A lot of my students go up to be nurses. One I think is getting ready to residency to be an ER doctor. And there's an up and down both sides of the river, have a lot of my students that you know, that are first responders, firefighters, you know, so. So the challenge is how do we make things substantially equal? I think you guys could help us with that on some level. But what do we do? I know it's right here. We leverage our community, whether we have three students in a class or 30. That's what we do. Thanks for listening.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Every community in this world does that. I know every volunteer fire and rescue organization assured people and they partner with the schools. Kids get involved, get additional training and that it just kind of makes and adheres to the community mindset too.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Well but I'm going to chew my horn a little bit I get students credentials. So there's training and then there's credentials I'm able to offer.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: One more question, just make sure we get to the other thing we have to leave.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Yeah, I just want to put

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: it back with every policy

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: we create or rules that we send down there there's always an exception to the rule and like this, this school up in this area is an exception to the rule. It's our job to make sure that that exception gets well noted and doesn't get unlike down where I am, I had our Ripton school only had 28 children going to it and they didn't couldn't find enough teachers and overhead so they finally closed that school and moved in fifteen minutes, fifteen minutes down to another school. Parents happy about that? No, but at least there was something close to deal with closing and going over to New Hampshire. You don't have that option if we're going to just keep a Vermont school and from what we see here it gives us a lot more knowledge to say, hey, this is an exception to the rule, especially up here in Essex County that just let's not mess with it, if

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: anything, see what else. And that's pretty important because then maybe Beth can correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't at the board meeting, like I wasn't directly at the board meeting, But I believe our board was looking to do looking at numbers and doing some combining in light of x 73. Is that correct?

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Yeah, we've been looking at a

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: lot of options, you know, because we hear it for those that don't know, I'm a business manager.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Okay. I'm a business

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: My name is Beth, I'm a business manager, and I've been this is my second time at Canaan. And this time around, I've been here at the school, through my fourth year. And since I've started the bottom line has always been the problem, you know, because we hear from a peer you can't be over 5%, you have to be between 25%. And I mean, when you have to account for raises, and you have to account for health insurance jumping 15% a year, you're now asking the district to figure out how to eat that. And where we're already, you know, so resource restricted, and we try to spend our money the best way that benefits our students. I mean, we reconfigure, we do crazy things, you know, ask people like they were talking before about getting dual certs, can you do this and can you do that to try to help, maybe not replace the teacher, and try to use if someone has open spots in their schedule to try to use those resources to still offer our kids the best education possible. But it definitely is a challenge. I when we're being told this is what you have to keep your budget in or it's going to get rejected, it's not easy. And the same thing with bringing back LEAP index and the excess funding threshold. The threshold per pupil cost is insane.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: One thing that may work well for you is we do a true foundation formula where everybody pays the same per 100 and then the money follows the weighted child back, may end up a better resource than you are now under the new foundation. I'm hoping that would be

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: the case pretty quickly. Do you run the numbers? Oh yeah, currently we're, I mean, last year we were penalized. There's probably you know I haven't seen our ADM yet because those are just due at the end of the week but there's a good chance you know it only went up a couple $100 what we're our threshold we're supposed to be below per per weighted ADM and I mean

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: what is your pupil spending I don't know how broken down that is between the stereotypes.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: It's broken down but in the areas it's probably roughly between I would say fifteen and seventeen. I don't have the number. Okay. I mean, we haven't finalized anything yet. But I mean, that's where we were last year. That's based on last year's numbers.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Can I ask, did you, you were, did you get a international firefighting grant from the federal government that got bought back? For the school loan. Okay. Somebody told me that Essex County lost a big firefighting grant between Canada, New Hampshire and Vermont schools like a firefighting training program.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: No, wasn't ours. Okay. And

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: also I think what helps the budget is that we're combined sports with New Hampshire so we share the budget.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: Right, we share the budget benefits us Pittsburgh and Stewartstown because they have the choice, we partner mainly with Pittsburgh but Stewartstown has the choice to play at whichever and a lot of them come here from straight across the river. So that's a budget that's shared and that's been going on now almost

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: with different things. Yeah, that way they can still have sports.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: We can still have

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: the sports just because again, like we do that, our be it back to our location we are small by necessity not by choice you know.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: So I think my district I think they have well they're taking credit for being the lowest studying districts in the state. Figure like 11,500 and all their budgets last time passed got the war and then the next time they put the vote on they passed. But you know they all all sit there and point at it they had to be overspending to get their budget passed for one thing so you all sacrificed a little bit but what did they give up? Know they must have given something up to get that cost per student down and that's what the funding formula is supposed to alleviate that. So everybody's on the same footing, the ADM could be one way or the other but that hopefully is going to benefit every school. So we haven't gotten to do yet.

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: Well Denise Wood I teach business and computer classes and in the afternoon I have the Business Administration and Technologies PCE program call it BAC and most of you see my my classroom my program is I would put it up against any other business program in the state. My students, because I teach at White Mountain Community College as well, I'm able to offer more college classes, dual enrollment. So the minimum that my students, if they complete my program, the minimum credit that they will earn 18. I've had students earn more. So the majority of my students when they enter college are usually entering a sophomore. Two years ago I had a student enter as a junior. He's an accounting major.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: So that's pretty

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: cool. We do a lot of hands on stuff. We have the school to store and that benefits the entire school as well. On Fridays the elementary students come down and it is just a buzz of activity, they look forward to that. We also work with local businesses, Border Tool and Die just down the street for example, they approached me last year and they were looking to rebrand, come up with a new logo and a new sign and they had my students tackle that project and it was great. My students absolutely loved that and they actually went with one of the designs. I have a previous student who opened, she just celebrated her one year anniversary being open as my favorite hairstylist in Coalbrook on Main Street. She's going to come and talk to my students about some of the challenges she's faced in the last year, go over some marketing strategies for them as well. FBLA, Future Business Leaders of America, that CTSO program, I embed that right into my afternoons because as I've already mentioned we are so isolated that one of the hardships of this area is students are involved in many things you guys heard this morning. So to ask a student who's already doing athletics to come in after school to participate in FBLA probably

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: not going to

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: get as high a level of participation. And so I've built that right into my curriculum. And as a result, they actually create quality projects and at the state level I've had the majority of my students every year placed in the top three and that qualifies them to attend the National Leadership Conference. And two years ago we went to Florida for the Nationals. Last summer it was California, and this year it will be Texas. And where does that money come from? Well, we don't get any Perkins funding because we're so little,

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: and so my students They took that away two years ago, we lost it.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: You had that before?

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: Yep, yep, did my thing.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: I used to get Perkins and we lost it due to our size.

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: That's a it was a federal only or was it passed through the state?

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: It was passed through the state. It was passed through the Okay.

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: So we made that.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Yeah. Yeah. What was that because of national rules or was that because of

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: I can't speak to who the decision it was, I just know it was based on our size. That's also when we shifted it on grants of high school.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: Denise, I don't know if it was, if those are state pass through rules or federal rules.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: That's what I'm

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: not sure. But then we know we could supplement it if it was

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: a federal. Because we used to get 20 to 30,000, if

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: I remember correctly. I mean, was going out

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: when I started, so.

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: And that funding used to pay for the industry recognized credentials, the RRCs, all their certifications. So now that is all on our local budget now because we get nothing for that. And so that creates a little bit of a challenge. And my students, if they've worked that hard, I want them to experience life outside of my own country. As I've already mentioned, some have never even been to St. Jay. And so to actually leave New England and get on an airplane and be at a venue where there are 16,000 plus students is a really big deal. And they get to improve their public speaking skills because they are presenting their projects live. And so we look for grants, we ask for local donations, my students present at the Tillotson Board, they present at Kiwanis, they do a lot of legwork and a lot of fundraisers. We just had a father daughter dance this past weekend, then all of that money goes, so we prepare for it.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: And that was great, Denise, by the way.

[Denise Wood (Business & Computer Teacher; CTE Business Administration & Technologies)]: Oh, thanks. My students do Keeping Up With Kanan videos, what's going on in the school? And then they wanted to do podcasts which you guys got a taste of this morning but we didn't have the equipment and so we applied for grants and I also got a grant through BREC, Vermont Rec, yeah small rural education that's what it was and we were able to get the equipment and you guys got to see the recording studio and they absolutely love it and the community loves it too so I guess the biggest thing for me is the loss of Perkins funding. It really creates a challenge for our students taking CTE because they go to another CTE center, there may be other opportunities that we've been creative and and try to afford them with those as well.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Well, what you have done is show them that if they want something and they work for it, they can get it and that that is something a lot of other schools, you know, don't do so. The life skills are. You know, way above some big schools that what you're doing way above

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: one of the things I took a group of students to Montpelier last year. They were very interested in everything that was going on Vermont education, we were talking about the United States government and how it works and how it functions and they wanted to see the state house and everything. And first, I was surprised because all the boys showed up in full suits and the girls showed up and they were looking immaculate. I was like, what happened? But one of the biggest compliments I got down there was a senator walked up to me, I can't remember who it was, but he said, your students have been some of the most diligent and well spoken kids we've ever had here. And I think it pertains a lot to that these kids have done a very have done a lot with a little. And that's not just because it's not just at school. A lot of them don't have the best of home lives. Or they've had to struggle in one way or another sacrifice. And yeah, they unfortunately, some of them are numb to it. They know that this is part of it.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: I will say one of the great benefits to a small school, I really know my students. I really get to know them and you think about the CTE program, I have them all afternoon, every day for two years. So I really get to know them, I get to know their families and I feel privileged because I get them on the tail end, I get to help them make that next step, whether it's going into college, into a career of their choosing, or opening a business. And so I think that's one of the benefits of a small school as well. By the way, I hope you get to watch the video of your students talking to us first earlier today, you're rock stars for them. I mean, I wrote down all your names. They, you know, like, the highlight of their life were these trips, clearly. Sweet. I I have been visiting a lot of CTEs and doing a lot of CTE work, I was telling your principal, there's a secret sauce here because all the cool kids are doing CTE. It's the cool place to be. We certainly need more of that. My chair has heard me say this, and now your principal has, so the important people won't be blindsided, but I'm working on a proposal so that CTE programs can be degree conferring. It's really challenging when some people who don't know them very well are responsible for whether or not they graduate or are going to be successful in their next steps. And in a lot of ways, I think kids are getting caught in a system that's not designed for 60% of students who are the ones who don't need to go to college to be successful in their next steps. So nobody's said no to me yet, which is gonna be hard for me to hear if somebody does, because I would love your reaction. I can't think of a better way to finally free kids who are on a different path from feeling others and held back in their passion.

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: Would like to add that I think the best definition of here is we are small but light. I think that we are very resource based and try to provide the best resources, education, and opportunities for students that they might not other have. And we have had three groups I believe last year FFA, PEAK Club, and FBLA all win the level of national Oh they told

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: us they told us I find you to see some medals or something

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: like trophies. They told us, you really should watch,

[Amy Keeper (K–12 Art Teacher; New Teacher Mentor)]: It it's a long

[Megan Primo (School Nurse; Student Support/After-School Coordinator)]: is a true community. It is from students to teachers to parents, like it is to businesses. It is a true community, and it is something that people want their children to have that they feel great about. It is nothing like I don't, you just can't compare this to anything else.

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: Don't know how

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: to say that, you just can't.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: So if we have just a couple minutes left, I was gonna give, and I think you, in a way, you just did what I was gonna ask people to do, which was give us the one takeaway that you want us to leave with, it's you think. We heard a lot from you, but if you want to just we just got off the first one.

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: I think for me, whenever I think of Canaan now, the school is the heart of the community. Everything happens here. It's the meeting ground. It's where kids get unique opportunities. It's where they can truly find themselves in a safe environment. They, you know, as Denise said, we get to know these kids really, really well. And the funny thing is, is that they continue to surprise us. Like, I probably learned just as much from my kids as they do for me. And, you know, I, you won't find a teacher in this building that wouldn't put the students before. Like they would put the students before themselves at every possible opportunity.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: Again, I'm kidding. I graduated from here and came back because I enjoyed it so much and wanted to raise my family in this area. And I think we see a lot of kids, whether they come back and work in the area and start a business, or they'll come back and visit and be like, hey, Mr. Nichols, guess what I'm doing? You'll see a lot of kids on their school breaks, or other times in the year, they'll come back and visit us and let us know how they're doing. So I think we're doing a good job raising students or they're helping us, know, raising our professionals too and be successful.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: Yep, and you know really what you're saying in a way that this is helping. Yeah.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: By the way, can I just say I have a one year old and a two and a half year old and I want someone to do like a Vermont PBF version of Miss Rachel and I like talk about mouth sounds? It sounds so like, I think I found the person. If you're interested. Yes,

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: I'm to go back to the Brigham case and just say that, you know, I'm going to put the list back on you guys the big takeaway remember it says ensures substantially equal educational opportunities. And moving forward, you know, please don't hem a school like for us, Kenan or schools like us hem us in with like those class sizes, because it's just really, it's just going to really hurt our students. I'd say that'd be the biggest takeaway, you have some good groundwork there already for some exemptions, I'd say for a school like ours, you know, we've always been fiscally responsible. You know, I say we're not broke, we don't need

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: to be fixed. Like you. Oh,

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: boy.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: I guess I'll piggyback on that. The lack of Perkins funding, if that could somehow be addressed or some alternative, because we have fixed costs and we have just a handful of students, you divvy that up, your cost per pupil, ours is going to be larger than others, even though we have pared back as far as we possibly can without really hurting our students and so even just one size fits all for the smaller schools it doesn't always does not always work that number it hurts. I guess

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: that's not all the back.

[Senator Terry Williams (Clerk)]: Sorry.

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: The opportunities that a school this size offers for the community is unbelievable. I mean, you know, I choose to bring my child here because of that, because of the opportunities that aren't at other places, you know, between the clubs and the after school and the summer school program and the sports, you know, I think we do really well with what we have. We work hard to keep it, you know, at a decent budget amount. We're very fiscally responsible. I don't think we have, you know, we try not to be excessive and we always try to get, you know, the best possible for the students. In the end, is the, you know the goal is are we providing what is needed

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: for your students for the students absolutely they said

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: we

[Kevin Falls (Middle/High School Social Studies Teacher)]: asked them

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: what more could you ask for that's what we heard right there yeah they believe they're getting everything that they need you know we really don't I don't know how you think

[Beth (Business Manager, Canaan Schools)]: much better than that administration you're not real hard at the mission you know and as a group we try to do the best we can that that will benefit our students.

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: We heard that.

[Todd Nichols (K–12 Physical Educator; CTE Emergency Services Instructor)]: You're welcome and thank you. And to reply to that, 99%

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: of our students, that's all they know. Yes.

[Senator Kesha Ram Hinsdale (Member; Senate Majority Leader)]: I know, as you were saying,

[Senator Steven Heffernan (Member)]: don't get the walls, there's walls around Cape, not little literally, but you don't get very far away and that happens down our way and that you've got families that just don't get her and even though they watch the news and see what else is out there, why do I want to leave? And if Canaan is as nice as

[Senator Seth Bongartz (Chair, Senate Education Committee)]: it is, why would you want to leave? So thanks.