Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Good morning. We're back in action at Center Agriculture. We're going to continue our discussion with our council, Bradley Sheldon. We have a draft version of 3.2. We've worked on a lot of small but not insignificant parts of it this morning, nailing down some if Indian Chad, as they might say. So we will if that's the right version, is it? She's That

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: was a reference.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Supposed to be a little bit nonpolitical in here. So but, Bradley, welcome. Thank you very much for coming in.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Thank you for having me. I

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: sent you, you accepted and I accepted the response back about the, some correspondence you had with the, control board. I don't know if, that had made the final draft, but I doubt that it did, but anyways. So

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: let me just take a look here. Linda, I know that you sent me

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: the Zoom link, I can't find it. Oh, just send me the link.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Thank you so much. And

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: So

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: there were So the cannabis control board sent a very small change earlier today that didn't get into this draft. Okay. And that changed And that change was to section eight fifty three, hemp and agriculture products, and it was a very small change.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: So it got built in either something like that?

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Actually, it was not. So maybe I don't have what.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Well, maybe it was just you guys that had further discussions, and that just got on.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Yeah. So what we were supposed to receive that I did not receive was a information on the the fees section of this bill. Which has not changed. Which has not changed. And I've asked for it a few times, and I have not received it.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Okay. So Pepper came in and basically said what they had is what they had. Okay. Okay. And what the assurance is that by the time all this hit the open market, that we would be back in session next year and that at that blessed time, it was still in the working group. They were still having conversations. That they were more than likely before it's all said and done, was to even exclude some salves and some ingestibles. As for right now, the bigger part of this was to get the language done so that these people could still do business, and that would But they still want to continue the conversation moving forward. Okay, okay.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: So for the only change then that I received from the agriculture excuse me, from the cannabis control board was this change to this is on page 40 of senate bill three twenty three, draft 3.2 dated 03/11/2026. Up on the screen here, page 40 lines 15. It just added just kind of an overarching piece here, saying that hemp is an agricultural product. Produced process marketing commercially traded in Vermont pursuant to this chapter, that we are moving from 10 o six to 10 o seven and the administrative rules of the municipal board. So that kind of adds some administrative due process protections to individuals who are applying for permits, appealing their denials, things of that sort. That is the only change that I received from them. If there are additional changes floating around

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: I believe so. I'm looking at the dates on the email, and I think I was just copying all of the summary conversation Okay. We've had in the past. Perfect.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: And so I can I'm going to scroll. It's a big deal. Scroll to my changes. And so the first change here on the draft is on page one, And we just said at least past twenty years of law because there is some not ambiguities, but the law as we currently know it is about twenty years old. But there's more law that preceded that that had the same effect of prohibiting municipalities from regulating agriculture. So we just added the appease there. And if you're watching on the screen, my apologies because you might be getting a little motion sick as I scroll through this bill, but we are on page nine. And this is a change to the accessory on farm permit. You know, as we've discussed before, you know, changes to Act two fifty are are are might be a little controversial in other committees, and but this is where this committee has landed, and the only change here from the last time we saw this bill was adding the equivalent of value of donated farm crops. And then later on, we say as used in the subsection, donated farm crops means charitable contributions of farm crops at a level under the statute and are made to an organization that's unrelated to the owner of the enrolled lands. So it's that same definition that we use in the the tax piece earlier on, and I was copying that definition here to permit donated farm crops when discerning whether someone needs an accessory nonfarm permit.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: I asked earlier, and I was shocked that Senator Plunkett couldn't answer. The Title 26 of the US Code, does that define what nonprofit is?

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Trust me.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: But that is that is and tax is Kirby's wheelhouse, and so I'm I'm kind of taking his lead on this. But if if you do want more information, Kevin, you can

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: report back. No. We're fine. Okay. How much how much is this changing on section four? How much is this changing the arm the the structure of permit as far as to what's already in law?

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: So that is a good question because right now it's based on a percentage of the farm sales, and so more than 50% of the farm sales have to come from products off the farm. And if you're changing it to a fixed dollar amount that adjusts for inflation, it depending on how much how much products that farm produces, it might be less than 50% of their products coming from the farm. You know, our it might be less than 50% of their products coming from the farm would actually be produced on the farm and and sold there. And so, you know, it potentially, it it for a large business, this this could be fairly meaningful and and not a lot of product could be actually produced and sold on the farm itself and be eligible for this exception. And that might be something that people take issue with because it could be the case that someone has a bar business that, as a percentage of their total sales, percentage of their total products, is is is selling someone else's stuff more than selling their own stuff, and that might hurt.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: K. I'll have a conversation with Doctor. Resources to look at that section as well. Go ahead, Dan.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: I mean, this section says, you know, not more than 250,000 adjusted inflation of sales of the prepared or processed qualifying products, number of products that are not produced on the farm. It's It's just depending on the size of the business. Could mean, one way or another, it could mean that they're potentially not using enough of their own product that they're producing on their farms or the business. So let's put in try to give us a scenario. We're at

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: a farm stand, a very well known farm stand.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Okay.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: And they have their product there, but they also buy maple syrup from a different Major maple syrup? Yeah, you know, yeah, from a different part of the state. That maple syrup sales outdoes their sales. Potentially, right? So that would kick over the 50% and then what happens at that point? What kicks in? Do they just get to say, Hey, you gotta watch this? What's the law really do? This just says, this is helping out people who wanna donate, wanna But I can see where you were coming from, that if you were selling still a Vermont product, but it came from somebody else's farm. Yeah. But it's about the permitting of

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: the Yeah. They need a permit for their vehicle. To serve stores. No permit for the right. Right. That's a great point. It's not a side thought. That's what it is. And at that point, if I'm gonna pay to go over that, then they'll need a promotion. So that in itself would let them say, Hey, listen, we should be careful with what we do here or we have to do the process. So they're not turning it into a large scale business, they're turning it on And

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: if you were, you'd want to hit the right mark. Right. I would hate it.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: So there, that answered it for me, apparently. I mean, yeah.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: Okay. Yeah, probably 99% of the people we deal with is. Right. Oh, yeah. Right.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: So it's not to create a big scale business to avoid it from it. If you want to be bigger, then you gotta get from it. That. We were proud of a great point in this thing, so. Yeah, well, that was a good discussion.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: On page 10 is an exchange. This was just a mistake. I confirmed with Kirby, but we're adding the equivalent value of donated farm crops to this section, the land use value appraisal, to permit donated farm crops to be to make someone eligible for land use value appraisal. And we're not quite sure how that worked out to be completed there, but it's back in. The next change is to the solar section. We are on page 11, is where the solar section starts. So most of that was removed, And this is Ellen's section. Unfortunately, Ellen was not available today. Was I was doing my best to follow the communications yesterday. We kinda went through this with Peter Sterling, and and so

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: I'm gonna let you finish it up, but I think we were, at the end of the day, I think we were happy with what we saw. Yeah,

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: and so this just requires a full spectrum audit of of the bradle to grave payback time in carbon dioxide emissions for licensing new solar and requiring that the fill facility comply with the conditioning requirements. You know, the facility is likely already required to do that, but if, you know, the committee's satisfied with the language, it's it's what we'll keep that in there.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: He pretty much said the same. They pretty much have to do that, but at least

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: another bottle of water.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Changes there. Okay, so just scrolling.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: Don't

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: think I have a very think that might actually be it, but I'm just kinda scrolling through.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: It's not page 40. We just

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: did that. We did that first. Yep. Did that first. You worked back.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Yes. Because we we started talking about cannabis because I had been waiting on something from them, but it turns out that they're happy with the language. And so that and that would be the fees language. And so the fees language on page 46, you know, that is a a fairly substantial reduction in the fees relative to the current statute, but that is a policy choice. And so as long as everyone is understands that and is comfortable with that, then there it is. There might be questions about the change, but that change, it seems to be something people are comfortable with. And that's Bill.

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: Thank you very much. Thanks for your hard work. I think

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: we're gonna be really good. Pass this out to one committee, have them take a look at it and a couple sections. We should hear back and Brian will love to sucker out. If everything goes away, I think it will. And

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: so just let me know if there's any additional changes, And if there are no additional changes, just ping me, and then I will send, like, a clean copy of the bill so then you can forward it. Because this bill has highlights, and that will anger everyone upset. Especially when it's blue. Hey. The yellow. I find the yellow harder on my eyes, but, you know

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Well, you're younger than Santa Clamore.

[Bradley Sheldon (Legislative Counsel)]: Alright. Well, thank you for having me again. Thank you,

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Bradley. Thank you for taking the time. We appreciate it very much. You're

[Sen. Joe Major (Vice Chair)]: very welcome.

[Sen. Russ Ingalls (Chair)]: Renny, anything else that you'd like to discuss? What we call it a day?