Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Speaker 0]: Alright. We are live. Hey. Good afternoon, everyone. Picking up work after lunch. And, first order of business, we're gonna take some time to hear a budget request from representatives from the Vermont Food Bank. Are they joining us in the gallery? Yes. Good to see you. Thanks.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: How are you, Carrie? Thank you, Chair Birong.

[Carrie Saylor, Vermont Foodbank]: Thank you, committee, for having me here today. I'm Carrie Saylor, the senior manager of government affairs at Vermont Food Bank. And we are also here because it's NEK Day. So top secret info, I am a resident of the Northeast Kingdom. And I'm also joined here today by Jen O'Farrell, who is the executive director of Northeast Kingdom Community Action, who is our largest partner in the Northeast Kingdom. I am a resident of Linden, and I want to make sure that you all know about our budget requests, and then I'm going give you a little bit of information. This was a very supportive committee last year, very similar request this year with a few little updates. As your committee well knows, in 'twenty three and 'twenty four, Vermont was challenged due to disastrous flooding around the state. In particular, that flooding hit some rural areas of the Northeast Kingdom very hard. In 2024, my family was one of many who were stranded for weeks because of washed out roads in all directions. Took about seven weeks until we could get vehicle access out of our house. In fact, the Linden emergency manager connected us with the local mountain rescue squad in case we needed emergency services. Our only way to route was a half mile hike uphill to catch rides with friends and family, or to hike in supplies like a generator and gas. We were fortunate. The generator allowed us to eat out of our freezer and our garden and to continue to use our stove. Feeding a family of four for eight weeks that way was challenging. And it got old hiking food in backpacks and, you know, begging neighbors to drop off milk. For us, it was simply stressful and frustrating. That was not the case for many of our neighbors. They didn't have those resources that we did and were not able to really weather that storm in the same way. At the food bank, we have collected stories from folks in those communities whose gardens washed out, whose refrigerators thawed, whose freezer thawed, and they have had to turn to our food bank partners in those communities to simply provide food for themselves during that period, and afterwards, because they couldn't replace what they had lost. I think one of the most telling moments of that was when I was helping at a Veggie Van Go event in the Northeast Kingdom. And a gentleman pulled through in a pickup truck and said, you know, during the floods and the power outages, we lost all of the meat that we had just bought from a farm in our freezer. They bought a year's worth of meat. Their freezer thawed and their meat was boiled. And so all of the money they had put into that that they'd saved up all year for was gone. Can't get replacement for that from your insurance company. And so was out of Veggie Van Gogh to get whatever free accessible food was available in the community, even though it was produce and not meat. Not a one to one. He also said they'd been using NECA's food shelf to try and find some replacements for the food that they had lost. But that's really how they were living day to day, and they weren't sure when they would be able to replace what they'd lost. That is not a standard request at one of those produce focused events. That is an indication of communities where basic needs are not able to be met after a disaster, and where Vermont Food Bank and our partners have stepped in to offer some kind of safety net. But it was not a systematic response. It was a stopgap. Our request for $1,000,000 in ready response is part of our $5,000,000 overall request this legislative session and budget FY '27. That ready response money is very similar to what we spoke about last year. It would go through Vermont emergency management and be used for planning and food access and potentially water in disasters. We're asking for that as base funding. And I know that that is somewhat controversial as an ask. But this request requires pre work with Vermont Emergency Management and the state administration to figure out how to make this money work best for communities across the state, how to utilize the existing resources of Vermont Food Bank's three distribution centers and two twenty network partners in a way that most efficiently serves communities who are likely to be hit by these disasters, and then those who have not been hit yet and how that might affect them. Excuse me. A lot of talking today. While floods and natural disasters are things that we have way too much experience with here in Vermont, I do want to bring to this committee's attention the disaster or the crisis that happened in November 2025, which was truly a food access emergency when the government shutdown caused a pause in SNAP benefits federally, which meant that the 65,000 people in Vermont who received Three Squares did not receive their benefits on November 1. I want to recognize and commend the legislature, the emergency board, the governors and his administration for the swift action to partially fund Three Squares Vermont for all of those folks across the state who rely on that program. And another committee this morning, a community member from Concord, Vermont shared, you know, as an elderly and disabled person, I qualify for EBT. In the tiny window of prior knowledge and preparedness before the government shutdown stopped SNAP benefits, I was able to grow sprouts from beans, make soups, and make do. One week later, Vermont stepped up and helped its people so we wouldn't have to make do. Elders could have more than crackers and tea, and kids could go to bed with a nice full tummy. With state funding, the food bank was able to grant $250,000 to about 55 food pantry partners in a matter of days. Those organizations in turn scrambled to purchase food to stock their shelves to help neighbors get through the November without Three Squares benefits until the state could partially load benefits onto people DBT cards. You'll hear a little bit from Jenna that that funding was very necessary, but logistically stretched food shelf staff, volunteers, community members working to purchase needed food, move that food into community food shelves, and be ready for what was often an overwhelming amount of need in those first few days of the month. While we all made it work, our partners stretched themselves to make it happen. And one recently shared with me that it felt just like when we had the floods. It was overwhelming. The charitable food system is built primarily on a collaborative effort of organizations across the state making the most of those efforts by distributing rescued edible food from grocers, retailers, and farms, and purchasing food to fill the gaps. During the pause in federal benefits, the opposite happened. Purchasing was the only way to adequately fill shelves quickly, and organizations instantly needed more capacity to do that work. We cannot continue to ask so much of our partners without together doing the work required to plan ahead, source and stage food resources, recognize that there are different needs and different structures and systems needed in an emergency response around food. We look forward to working together with this committee, with our partners at Vermont Emergency Management, and with our network of partners across the state to ensure that people in Vermont are food secure even in emergencies and disasters. Thank you for your time, for your support of the Food Bank's FY $275,000,000 dollars request, particularly the portion on Ready Response. I'm talking to other committees and you may also hear we're asking for $2,000,000 to support Vermont Food Banks, Vermont is feeding Vermonters local food purchasing program and $2,000,000 to support our network of partners. Thank you.

[Speaker 0]: Representative Penden?

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: You. I just wanted to ask you if you would kindly send us an official budget letter with your ask from this committee, and that would be really helpful. Yes, I'd be happy to. Thank you. Can I?

[Speaker 0]: Oh, please, yes.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: I'm

[Jenna O'Farrell, Executive Director, Northeast Kingdom Community Action]: Jenna O'Farrell St. John's Bray. I'm the Executive Director of Northeast Kingdom Community Action. We're the community action agency that serves Caledonia, Orleans and Essex County. I'm here in support of the Food Bank, because they are here in support of everyone in Vermont. I thank you for the opportunity to share today how our rural communities recovered from two devastating floods with the critical support of the Vermont Food Bank, and what these experiences reveal about how much we must strengthen resilience moving forward. In July, I don't think it's often that testimony mirrors testimony. And I think it was so interesting to just hear Carrie's for the first time from the Vermont Food Bank, where they sit as the lead food agency and then where we sit as community providers. And I think you're going hear a correlation between the two, because that's how closely we work together. And we need to because food is life and we need to feed our most vulnerable people in Vermont. In July 2023, and again in July 2024, communities across the Northeast Kingdom were severely impacted by catastrophic flooding caused by torrential rainstorms. Rivers overtopped their banks, infrastructure failed, and long standing drainage limitations were laid bare. Entire neighborhoods were affected, homes were damaged, access to basic necessities disrupted. Access to food and clean drinking water was urgent. With the support of the Vermont Food Bank, we were able to respond immediately. The Vermont Food Bank delivered water and shelf stable food directly to our centers, allowing us to distribute supplies locally and transport them into some of the most rural and hardest hit communities throughout the Northeast Kingdom. Their responsiveness ensured that families had access to essentials at a time when systems were strained and options were limited. In November 2025, the Vermont Food Bank was positioned to provide direct funds to network partners. The Legislative Emergency Board approved the release of funds to provide two weeks of November Three Squares Vermont SNAP benefits to enrolled Vermonters. Because the processing of those funds onto EBT cards could not be completed until November 7, the Emergency Board authorized the Department for Children and Families to award $250,000 to Vermont Food Bank to be channeled to some of the select network partners. NECA received a portion of these funds that allowed our Northeast Kingdom food pantries to purchase food in response to the increased community need during this gap in SNAP benefits. We thank you and the Governor and the Emergency Board for the funds to make the additional food purchases possible. We use those funds to rapidly purchase and distribute staple foods like pasta, canned chicken, peanut butter, cooking oil, canned soups, and distribute to our food shelf locations in St. Johnsbury Island Pond in Newport. We also set up mobile outreach locations for our rural Head Start families. While that effort was successful and resulted in households and families receiving additional food to get them through the first week in November, it was a difficult moment logistically to respond to the emergency need for grocery foods in three different counties in just a few days. This response felt very similar to the response of the floods in 2023 and 2024. Our staff worked overtime on weekends, and they traveled a pretty long distance to actually be able to purchase that much food in bulk. In rural Vermont, waiting for state and federal assistance was not feasible, in the early days of disasters. Local municipalities lacked the funding and capacity to provide immediate relief during recovery phases. Volunteers stepped into leadership roles despite facing their own hardships. While Vermonters are deeply resilient, resilience alone is not enough. It must be matched with reliable infrastructure and trusted partners. The Vermont Food Bank fills that gap and plays a vital role in ensuring communities can meet their basic needs during crisis. Across the Northeast Kingdom, organizations have built strong, respectful and collaborative relationships grounded in a shared commitment to community and well-being. However, during these disasters, we were collectively under resourced and exhausted. Vermont's geopolitical landscape presents real challenges to implementing a county centered response recovery model. Service areas across the state, across state agencies, designated agencies, community action agencies, school districts, and health service regions do not often align, making coordinated disaster responses and recovery very difficult. These structural realities underscore why the Vermont Food Bank is a statewide trusted partner and effective resource in times of crisis. It is nimble, responsive and grounded in local relationships. As we look forward to the future, strengthening disaster resilience in rural Vermont will require investment in local capacity, clear coordination and continued support for organizations like Vermont Food Bank that consistently meet communities where they are in quick, respectful and effective ways when Vermonters need it the most. Thank you.

[Speaker 0]: You for that. Any questions from the committee for either of them?

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: As

[Speaker 0]: Representative Hango said in the more refined letter for the pleasure of our last firm.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: That's the email that's Nick.

[Speaker 0]: Thank you. We love government efficiency in this committee. Alright. Well, thank you very much. We appreciate all of you coming in. Enjoy the rest of the day with the Northeast Kingdom folks.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Thank you. Speaking

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: of Kingdom folks, representative Berg.

[Speaker 0]: Let's talk Danville.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Did coordinate that? Yeah. I thought so.

[Speaker 0]: We've been planning it for weeks.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Just being efficient, that's all. Right?

[Speaker 0]: Gotta read the room, you know? Yeah.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: For the record, Greg Burke, here to talk about the Charlotte Of Danville. Mhmm. Yeah. I did you get the letter packet I sent you yesterday? Yes. I saw that email come in. I, the reason why I kinda had this charter sent to your committee was because I was a little worried about the process that this went through. I received a letter from Michelle Leclerc, Danville Town Clerk, explaining reasoning for their charter proposal. And it said in the letter, I just look back, I'll just read it. In working through the charter repeal process per 17 VSA two six four five, we did make at least one mistake. The select board scheduled the public hearings at the town meeting, informational meetings to maximize attendance. So the first hearing was twenty four days before the vote, not at least thirty. We did not realize the mistake until two days before the first meeting. There's better than usual attendance at the meetings, and normally, literally no one from the public shows up for the special purpose public hearing meeting. So we hope the legislature will forgive this error. I didn't feel comfortable introducing it based off of that. I wanted to make sure that I'm through some sort of process because it didn't actually follow. I don't know where where it is in statute that they're supposed to have a public hearing prior to thirty days, it sounds like. So that's why I talked to Ledge Council, and they suggested having it go to your committee. Okay. And but the reason why I wanted I did a request to meet with you all was I know town meeting's coming. I just love to see this get resolved sooner than later, and I can come back to them with something.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Okay.

[Speaker 0]: And we'll go through we can go through the nuance of that with counsel when we shift forward in. So but it was just seems it was the and apologies. I'm just putting my eyes on this letter for the first time now. Yeah. So, was short on days with the warning by six. I see what you're telling us.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Okay. So, yeah, I didn't get comfortable.

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: I got a representative Hango, then I got a representative Waters Evans.

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: Yeah, I guess, I'm sorry, Reverend Bert, I didn't know that the procedure hadn't been followed. So I don't really feel comfortable at this point doing much about it until a legal vote is taken or a legal meeting happens. I'm kind of a stickler.

[Speaker 0]: Makes sense.

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: But that's just my personal opinion.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Doctor. Waters Evans?

[Representative Chea Waters Evans (Ranking Member)]: Is your hope that if we handle this now ish, that it will get on the ballot in time for you to properly warn it and then vote again before town meetings.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: That's the whole thing. Yes. Just giving them the opportunity to do that. Yeah.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Okay.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: I just wanted to come back with them with some Mhmm. With another opinion outside of my own to say that this doesn't work and that you need to redo it.

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: Sure.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Okay. Unless you saw some loophole that you knew of in statute or something. I just it's not my wheelhouse.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: We don't love a loop. Yeah.

[Speaker 0]: We don't like loophole. We like abiding by statute with curvatures.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Yes. Yes.

[Speaker 0]: Yes. I saw a hand up in the Zoom box.

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: Hey, Glenn Herron. I'm, with the town of Danville. I'm the, vice chair for the select board. And I was on the town meeting committee that recommended this. I I would just point out that the process, that we that we made a mistake on is all related to requesting the legislature do this. The the town itself actually doesn't control its charter. You guys do. So the fact that we screwed up the process a very small bit and actually in the process got more people involved than normally would, I don't think you should make us go back and go through another two year long process for what's essentially a very simple matter that are Well, I'll just leave it at that. But I'm happy to talk about the issue if you'd like.

[Speaker 0]: Okay. No, I understand what you're saying, sir. Yes. And I also see we Janice O'Learn. Hi, Janice.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Hi.

[Speaker 0]: Got anything to add on the matter at hand?

[Janice O'Learn, Danville Town Meeting Committee member]: No, Glenn was the person that spearheaded this effort because he was on the town services committee that did an in-depth study of town meeting, Excuse me, town meeting committee. So I think he he has more to offer.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Okay,

[Speaker 0]: I just saw you there. I want you to feel left out.

[Janice O'Learn, Danville Town Meeting Committee member]: Oh, that's Okay.

[Speaker 0]: And I mean, is a pretty. Yes, I'm just looking at the. Appeal, you know.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Glenn, I've got I see him at the apple orchard every so often.

[Speaker 0]: You, Glenn, do you know what the, or Janice, what the vote was?

[Janice O'Learn, Danville Town Meeting Committee member]: Yes, it was 150 to 112.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Gotcha.

[Speaker 0]: And, you said you had better turnout than most of these, these votes as far as population showing up. What would be just a similar race voter turnout for something of this nature? Any idea?

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: I would say, I mean, we don't obviously, we don't talk about charter changes very frequently.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Correct. The

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: for the part that we screwed up, which was the information meetings, we usually get, like, three people, two or three people at the first meeting. And I think we had 12 or 15 at the Yes. First

[Speaker 0]: Oh, okay. So that was where the numbers were buried. Gotcha.

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: Yes. Yeah. And I would just point out again, the only thing our charter does is limit the ways that we can choose to vote, as in taking away our choice to vote. Most towns would be able to decide, hey, we wanna change from Australian ballot, and we wanna go to something else, or we'd like to maybe do a combined town and highway budget. That was something we just ran into that we can't do because our charter says that we were forced to do it this way. But the law already provides a very, good and robust way for towns to change how they do voting, and we would just like to follow that law instead of having our own charter that does says that Danville and only Danville has to do it this particular way. It's a it's a pretty simple matter. We just like to go back to becoming the way every other town is.

[Speaker 0]: Rebecca?

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: I just wanted to clarify because I had said that I didn't like the idea that the meeting warning was six days short, but you just want to bring it you just want to rerun it and bring it back to your voters and know that we're now?

[Speaker 0]: And what's the deal with?

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: It wasn't the official warning. It's that the law for charter revisions requires information meetings at certain times, and we thought we could with combine the regular information meetings for town warnings. But then, a couple days before the second meeting, we discovered that, oops, the charter revision law says that the first morning has to be something like forty days before, and we had it thirty six or or maybe it's thirty days. Mean, the only thing that was an error was the way that we held the informational meetings. We did have a lot of discussion around the town. There are some people who want to keep Australian ballot forever. And that's fine, because this won't actually change that. This just gives us in the future the option that if, you if you guys vote to allow people to use, you know, vote by phone, we can't do that. Or if, you know, if the whatever happens in the future, we're stuck with this as long as we have a charter. And obviously, it's a very long process to change your charter. So we'd like to get rid of our charter and go back to what the way every other town works, which means we'll continue voting on our budgets the same way we have by Australian ballot for the foreseeable future. But if anything ever does change without the charter, we'll be able to change it just like any other town.

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: Thanks. I'm still uncomfortable with the fact that the procedure wasn't followed properly.

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: And I would just say to you, ma'am, that the fact that we screwed up the procedure a teeny tiny bit doesn't affect whether or not you follow through with our request. Because all of this is about requesting, the town requesting that the legislature do this, and you could do it on your own. Sometimes the legislature allows charter appeals or charter changes, and sometimes it doesn't. We're just pointing out that Danville has a charter that really doesn't make a lot of sense because you already have laws that allow the same thing. So I would just urge you to please let this proceed, and don't have us kick this down the road again for another year or two process.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Representative, were you looking to Yes, I have jump a question that I was actually gonna ask to Glenn. Glenn, what would the process look like if you for simply putting doing another informational meeting in for the town of Danville, but doing it properly and having it, you know, within the thirty day time frame? Is that a significant burden to go about doing that again? Is that or is that just simply providing two more informational meetings? Is that something that's not logistically too much of a burden for your select board?

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: It's not a terrible burden, sir. It just takes a it just delays because the charter vote, I believe, has to be done by Australian ballot. There's no particular reason for us to do this as a special function because then we would get even less people voting. So we would wanna do it as part of town meeting. It's already too late to warrant for this year. So we would basically do the exact same things we did two years ago, again, in 2027, except we would make sure that we had an extra informational meeting just for the charter change before we started the regular information meetings for a regular town meeting. It's not a it's not a burden. It just delays. And then, of course

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Yeah.

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: After the town meeting vote, we'd have to forward it to the legislature again, and you'd have to go back through the same process. So we're probably talking two or three more years. It's not a it's not a big deal. It just is silly.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah. You're looking at best case scenario fourteen months. Yeah. Late next year. Yeah. Fourteen, fifteen months. So your next session. Yeah. Next session after kind of meeting date, best case scenario. Okay, understood. This is far more clear, at least in my mind. Any questions for our guests from the table? Seeing no hands, I see a hand.

[Representative Chea Waters Evans (Ranking Member)]: You still be able to continue to conduct your business as usual if it is delayed for fourteen months?

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: Yes. There's no rush. As far as I know, there's no real push to get rid of this now. The only issue is when if and when there ever is an issue, it's at least fourteen months to fix it. So we'd like to get it taken care of sooner rather than later. And we've already gone through all this into town. It it just seems silly to have to go through it again. That's all.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Thank you. Thank you. Excellent.

[Speaker 0]: Hey, yes.

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: Second last call on hand. Saying none. Thank you, representative. If our guests on Zoom would like

[Speaker 0]: to stay with us while we speak to council, please feel free.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Sure.

[Speaker 0]: Thank you.

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: You. Good afternoon, everyone. Tucker Anderson, legislative counsel. I'm gonna apologize in advance. I was supposed to be in the senate five minutes ago, so I have approximately two minutes to get you through this bill and address some of the questions that have come up. Thank you, sir. So page five ten repeals one section of the Danville charter. Danville charter consists of one section. This is effectively repealing the entirety of the Danville charter. As you've heard, requires Australian ballot system for particular votes within the municipality, the budget being one of those items. Also, as you heard, these are systems that under general law can be rescinded by the voters under, 17 VSA section twenty six eighty. That's all that I have about the operative provisions within h five ten, speaking to the procedural defects with how the vote was held. I have reminded you in the past, and you've heard some of this from your witness, that you have the power. Mhmm. And, the authority of municipal corporations are solely within the plenary authority of the general assembly. You delegate legislative authority to them, and you revoke it at will. 17 BSA section twenty six forty five was developed by the general assembly so that there would be uniform procedures used by all of municipalities that are asking for special authority from the general assembly in order to make sure that voters have appropriate information, and to make sure that there is, to some extent, some equity in treatment between municipalities. A procedural defect from a municipality has been treated different ways by different iterations of your committee over the last decade. In some cases, the committee has refused to take up charter proposals when there are procedural defects. Sometimes municipal corporations are given leeway. If I were to point you to some sort of consistency in the treatment, it would just be that the committee takes some time to determine whether or not the voters had adequate information and at the appropriate times to make an informed decision based on the charter proposal. Something that I would point out for both the committee, for the witnesses, and the people of Danville is that a couple years ago, the general assembly adopted 17 VSA section twenty six forty five a, which allows municipalities to suspend their charter provisions and to use general law. And that suspension of state law lasts for three years. And in that three year period, the municipality must notify your committee and the Senate Government Operations Committee and may request as part of that process that you consider permanently repealing those provisions of the chart. That system was set up to address situations like Danville's where they have found that they are constrained by their charter in a way that other municipalities are not and what they are asking for is simply that those provisions be repealed. So that is something that is available. It does not have the same process. I won't qualify it as Congressman Berger than some. As 17 VSA section 2,645, it does only last for three years. But it is another avenue that municipal corporations have. For purposes of the Charter Amendment procedure, it is exacting. The timelines are very precise. And as I've stated, it's been, treated different ways by different versions of your committee in the past. Overarching note, just since we've done so many charters this week, and likely charters will continue to happen throughout this session and into the future, I did create a OneDrive folder where all of the materials that are verified by the secretary of state are deposited for your consideration, and the town of Danville charter packet is in that folder. So if you have questions about vote totals, the letter that came from the clerk as a front page for the charter packet, or any of the other materials including warnings, all of that, just a click away. Centrally housed. Thank you, counsel. Representative Hango.

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: Thank you. That three year letter of suspension, does it, is it automatically granted once it passes the entire legislature? So it starts on that date that it's passed. And what happens after the three years?

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: After the three years and the statute is silent on this, perhaps intentionally so, There is no prohibition on the municipal corporation holding a subsequent vote, but after three years, the suspension is over and the charter authority goes back in place unless it has been repealed by the general assembly. However, there's lots of discussion at the time that act one fifty seven was being put together around whether municipal corporations could just continuously hold subsequent votes to suspend. And it seems that, yes, they could, but they would have to get together at least once every three years to vote to suspend those charter provisions. Thanks. Okay. Conscious of council's time.

[Speaker 0]: Anyone else? Seeing no hands, be gone

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: with you, sir. Thank you. Off to discuss libraries in the senate. What an exciting career I found less open. Yes. Service and betterment of the greater good at the state of Vermont, sir.

[Representative Lisa Hango (Vice Chair)]: I know. Have a library. The library is a really interesting.

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: Says the bowtie of attorney. Yes.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Representative Waters Evans.

[Representative Chea Waters Evans (Ranking Member)]: I am encouraged by what we just heard from Ledge Council. It seems like there's a way for the people of Danville to get what they want in the immediate. Time period without having to say it's okay that you didn't follow the rules. It'll give that that three year period gives them adequate time to reveal it for good. Seems like you might have the best of both.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: I mean, at least we have a table of options here to consider. It makes me feel better. Yeah. I feel bad for them that they missed the deadline, but also I love the deadline. Any

[Speaker 0]: questions for the folks from Danville from the committee? Thanks, folks. Okay, we're gonna noodle on this a little bit, but we will certainly be back in touch. Yes. Thank you.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Thank very much.

[Speaker 0]: Did you have something to add?

[Glenn Herron, Vice Chair, Danville Selectboard]: I'd just like to point out that we don't have any rush on this. What we want to do is want to get rid of it permanently. And we've already gone through all the steps. We got a lot of participation. It's gonna, I'm not saying we can't do it again. I'm just saying we really don't have to, and you're forcing, and I would urge you to please just put this forward and revoke our charter so that we can go back to being the way we have, we, and the other town is. Yes, we can go through all of those steps again. It's not a tremendous administrative burden, but it's just silly. The town has already voted. We've talked about it. We've talked about it at length. I would just urge you to please use your power because you control what towns can do to just do it, even if we made a very small mistake. Thank you.

[Speaker 0]: Thank you. No, I totally understand your perspective, sir. Yep. Okay. Well, thank you very much. And on cue, Representative Wozzek.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Sneezed the talking. Hello, committee. Welcome back, sir. Thank you. Thank you.

[Speaker 0]: Maintaining the integrity of low lying claims for the purpose of cannabis cultivation? I think we should. Yes.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Thank you. That's always been a fan

[Speaker 0]: of whatever Just trying to dovetail your builds here. Thank you.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: And I loved the last speaker's effort of just do it. And, you know, I'm gonna encourage you to keep that energy as we move into this. H six seventy nine. Thank you so much. Was proud of that one. Teddy Wazak, Barrie City.

[Speaker 0]: If nothing else, you give great table presentations. I've always been a fan

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: of the presence. Thank you. It's, my theater major background.

[Speaker 0]: Glad you're doing something with it.

[Carrie Saylor, Vermont Foodbank]: We were

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: at theater together. Sorry. Salem State University, great program. Didn't last. Okay. Bring

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: it So, back, people. It's just Teddy, you and I were

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: So I just spoke briefly with counsel on his way downstairs. He has to be in the Senate right now.

[Speaker 0]: Yeah, we crossed

[Tucker Anderson, Legislative Counsel]: the streams on attorneys today.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: But h six seventy nine is It's not on my screen. Very simple in terms of the context of this conversation. It's And that h six seventy nine is simply reintroducing all of the bits of legislation that was proposed in last year's flood bill that for one reason or another did not make it over the finish line. So a lot of the text in here should look very familiar to you. It's talking about financial assistance for flood impacted for all hazard as we change it to impacted municipalities. The voluntary buyout program at the state level, the homeowner assistance program, state aid for town highways, specifically rural and flood prone municipalities to upgrade their infrastructure. I think that's especially important as we're talking about the current state of the transportation fund and the capacity of AOT to assist our smallest towns that typically do not have fully professionalized not professionalized in the way of their ability to do the job, but just the amount of staff that they have, the amount of municipal infrastructure that they have in terms of employees to assist in the cleanup in the aftermath of a flood event. Lot of technical assistance, those two staff positions for the Agency of National Resources. And one thing that I do wanna specifically call your attention to at the very end of the bill, you will see in section eight appropriations, a $5,000,000 ask, to be directed towards specifically Essex and Orleans County. You may recall that the president denied the disaster declaration for the flooding of 2020 what year is it? '5. So the Northeast Kingdom experienced, localized flooding events in 2025. The state requested a disaster declaration. The president denied that disaster declaration, which puts the kibosh on any, FEMA assistance for those two counties. I was talking to the chief recovery officer. I don't think that's the job title. I was chatting with Doug Farnham earlier today, and he reports that they have not heard back on the appeal of that disaster declaration. So they got the denial. The, our state administration, administration has appealed that, made some tweaks to the application. They have not heard that from the federal government as to whether that will be, approved or denied on appeal. Did miss Perrono give

[Speaker 0]: you an inclination as to when he you filed the appeal,

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: or they filed the appeal? They filed the appeal, I think, within the past six weeks. Maybe I think it was right before the new year, if I'm remembering correctly. It was a very short exchange I had with Doug today. But I will just ask you all to keep that specific piece in mind, because if that appeal is not successful, Essex And Orleans County, which disproportionately has less financial resources, less staff, will be, if you'll forgive the pun, left out too dry. If there is no female support, they will be left on their own. And we learned in Barrie and Montpelier how much support even significantly staffed and significantly financial financially resourced communities like mine are comparatively to the rest of the state. It was a huge slog to get through the paperwork required and just get through the physical labor of now, we also did not plan this, but it does happen to be Northeast Kingdom Day here in the state house today. And I just can't cannot emphasize enough the struggle that those towns will be placed in if there is no forthcoming state assistance if that FEMA declaration, is not overturned on appeal. And we hope it is. And if it is, great. We don't really need this appropriation. And I understand how tight budgets are this year, especially. But these communities need a lifeline. And, you know, we fought really hard over the past two, three years to bring the supports to Central And Southern Vermont when it was the most needed, and I'm hoping that the legislature will extend that same grace to the Northeast Kingdom, as we have these conversations. So that's the main point that I wanted to make today is that, you know, we were there for Central Vermont. We were there for Southern Vermont. We were there for the Champlain Valley. We need to be there for the Northeast Kingdom too. And other than that, like I said, all of the rest of the language, some of the dates have been adjusted to update that it's at 2026 and not 2025. But the rest of the bill is as was introduced in March last year. And I will say to that, the FEMA denial for the Northeast Kingdom is the latest in what I feel comfortable calling political retribution from the federal government, and we are seeing that play out in a lot of different ways across the country. But we can't let that distract from the fact that there has been a stated goal of the current president to, dismantle FEMA and send it back to the states. And we can agree or disagree about whether that's the right approach to take, but if that is going to happen, the state needs to be ready for it, we need to start building systems now so that we don't get the rug completely pulled from under us, if and when, FEMA is dissolved or significantly scaled back. And so I think we heard a lot from the administration last year of, you know, why, why reinvent the wheel? Why put state programs in place when we already have these programs at the federal level? And I think that it's very important to acknowledge that this president does tend to do what he says he's going to do in a lot of different ways. And one of these stated goals has been putting the duties of FEMA back to the states. And so I think that it is very worth the conversation to make sure that we are ready for that when and if it happens.

[Representative Greg Burke (Danville area)]: Got it.

[Speaker 0]: So, yes, it's very familiar language for folks. So I appreciate you bringing those back. We also do intend on having a conversation about other components in and around the subject matter. So, we're gonna take a look at a few other bills that are relevant to this for possible for consideration of inclusion within it, just to make you care that might be some guests on your bill number.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Come on, come on.

[Speaker 0]: I know you're open to it. I just want to let it be pretty open.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: I appreciate that. I think, you know, likewise too, I mentioned this last year, this is by no means a representative who has this act wish list legislation. This has come from a bipartisan group members of flood caucus from all over the state that are asking for these types questions. So that being

[Speaker 0]: said No, I know that your name alone here does not mean it is monofocus to like your view. Yes. And we're working on these things year over year at this point. So, you know, trying I I actually appreciate the time effectiveness of just putting it in with a single sponsor that we're doing this is to not delay its introduction.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Yeah. Yeah. And representative is on this bill as well. Oh, you go. Oopsie. Sorry. Yeah. It is the two of It's

[Speaker 0]: in her name a lot of my inbox lately, so I was just kinda glazed over it. So any questions for representative Wozzek? Yes, Representative Chittenden.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: I was just wondering if you could paint a picture of what this funding looks like if these counties don't get it and if they do. Sure. So I think I'll start high level. Dollars 5,000,000, the damage to Essex and Orleans County after the '20 twenty five floods, was estimated to be 3,000,000 to $5,000,000 So that's how we landed on the $5,000,000 schedule. That looks like it's very different town to town depending on what their general looks like.

[Representative Chittenden (first name unknown)]: Most of FEMA works on a reimbursement schedule, so there are some towns who have begun to do some work that they're hoping to be reimbursed. And then VEM will know the details of that a lot better than I would, town by town where projects are not happening. So I imagine that for some towns, that would be again, this is all, couched in assuming the FEMA appeal is unsuccessful. I would imagine that some towns are waiting on reimbursements and that that money would replace the reimbursements that they would not get from FEMA. Some towns with very small budgets may not even be able to begin some of the work to recover from the floods of twenty twenty five, because they just don't have the cash. So I could also imagine situations in which towns are sitting and waiting to find out before they agree to pay to replace that culvert or that bridge, etcetera. And like I said, I'm sure VEM has a better idea of what, specific projects are needed in what towns and who's made progress where. Right? But we saw that play out in Central Vermont after 2024. You know, Barrie City, we were fortunate.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: We had a we had a fund balance reserve. We have the capacity to bond and to borrow, whereas the damages to Plainfield Vermont, exceeded their annual budget. And they just straight ran out of cash at one point. And so I would imagine that there are towns in the North in Essex and Orleans County that are in that same position. And also just wanna name, it was not a slight to, Caledonia County that they were not included here. But I felt it was important to if we're framing this as a potential state step up in absence of FEMA, the FEMA disaster declaration application was for Essex and Orleans County specifically. So I felt it was important to match that there. So I think to directly answer your question, it's $5,000,000 because that was the estimated amount of the damages. And what that looks like on a town to town basis is different depending on municipality.

[Speaker 0]: Anything for the esteemed member, Barry? Well, thank you for helping. Just refresh us on that, and the additional as to why with the perforation. And our fingers crossed on the appeal. But I thank you for the context for that.

[Representative Teddy Wazak (Barre City)]: Yeah. And I think the only other thing I'd add on the appeal is that not in this most recent exchange with, Doug Farnam, but previously, he had stated to the media and to others that, there was no one left in state government who could remember the last time we had to appeal a FEMA declaration. So we are very much in uncharted waters, pun intended, in waiting for the decision of an appeal to denied declaration. Nearly heard.

[Speaker 0]: We are gonna actually wrap before the floor because we all have independent projects to work on right now, getting bills organized and, with this testimony teed up on the stuff we are working on. So, if you get to hold back for one second. Chuck representative, I'd like to chat with you before you take off. But with that, let's, just go offline now and utilize this time for that type of administrative work. Thank you very much. That wraps the committee day on Jan.