Vermont Legislature SmartTranscripts:

[Troy Headrick]: We are live.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Welcome, folks. This is House Corrections and Institutions. It is Wednesday, April 1. Happy April Fool's Day, everybody. And I know it looks skimpy to folks who are looking at the committee. There are a few of us here. Have three

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: We have the A team here, it's all right.

[Alice M. Emmons]: We have three people who are out sick and two of those three are zooming in with us. So we do have a quorum and we're gonna be looking at section 18 on our spreadsheet, which is the reallocations of general fund dollars for cash that had been appropriated three years ago with certain projects within our capital budget. We had to be here with Joe Luneau. Joe, why don't you come up front? And I apologize that we didn't get into this. We were taking regular testimony. We didn't take regular testimony on this while we were working on the bill. And I know that we have spoken a little bit of the reallocations for 126th Street, but there's other cash reallocations that we wanna go into. Get a better visibility of the project. And there's some substantial money here that's being reallocated. So, Gerald, it's all yours.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Good morning. For the record, Joe Luneau, director of design and construction with buildings and general services. Madam chair, would you like to start on Row 191?

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yes.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Okay. Planning and reuse and contingency. Everything we'll be looking at here are the cash funds. And I think part of this problem of why it is being carried forward and was not expended or encumbered is the fact that just dealing with cash as not using it first. Oh, And I clearly understand that, but I think, you know, it was the way it came out, first time news and all of that. I think that was one of those things that we miss when we're drafting contracts and the likes of that of not looking at the cash line as opposed to the bonded funds. The debt ID is different than we've had in the past. If you noticed on all of these, starts with 900 Then the act year. I think that's where a few of these come from is the fact that we did not use our old money folks. We should have.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Is that why it's calculated because it's general fund dollars and it goes through the appropriation process, and that's why there's a different tracking number? Yes. It

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: is accounted for differently. Yes. As opposed to the bond funds.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So when did that really start coming to your attention from all the other projects that are that are funded with cash? Are you now paying attention to those those cash dollars?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yes, we are. I mean, it was one of those things, I think, for mainly my staff, when they were looking at a project, it was in a different location. So, know, we were looking typically, everything's in section two, or other sections that we're dealing with, you know, if we're dealing with parameter correction, corrections, excuse me, there are two, three project managers specifically that really deal with corrections, and they know where to be looking at that are looking at a whole different section of cash and the way we have it on accounted for in the SharePoint site. Here's a line cash is down here and not really scrolling and remembering to be looking at this when they're putting their projects together in their contracts. And then it was also one of those that when paying the invoices, not using the cash first, realizing that, you know, there's a timeframe on that one that's shorter than our bonded funds.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So, is a learning curve. And we did the same thing here in looking at the reallocations. We really weren't focused on cash. This is the first time we've really had substantial amount of cash that was paid when I was in. Because they hit the three year mark, then it wasn't.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: So now we've adjusted. Yes. We've adjusted now that, you know, you you look at your cash first. Spend the cash first because of the timeframe on that one as opposed to the bonded funds.

[James Gregoire]: And really quick, Joe, say that again.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: So down on those lines, when

[James Gregoire]: it says 900 in the front, what's that delineated?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: The 900 is what was developed with the commissioner and finance office is the fact that those were cash funds. So when you looked at that number, you knew they were actually cash funds. Actually created a bigger problem for us. Because our debt IDs normally would start out with a year of the

[Alice M. Emmons]: act. Correct.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: And this is only a point in time. We're actually getting rid of the 900. So that should also help in our accounting processes also. 900 drops it right to the bottom.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Literally. 900

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: drops it to the bottom of it. So there is that little bit of going on with that. And that 119 for planting, reuse and contingency would have been consumed earlier because the way that line item is. It's just that it was missed.

[Alice M. Emmons]: We're learning. We're all learning. We've never really had this type structure to the capital budget. Next

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: up, on line 190 2, we have 120 State Street rental in HVAC. We also have that on one line item 198. So there are two for 120 State Street. The first one being a million dollars and 1,500,000.0. And some of the early past testimony in this is that we're working with what happens with the whole flood recovery and how 120 plays into that mix. These funds here are simply ready to go to start that process so that when we get our final note from FEMA and agree on a final price, then are planning for the complex and how 120 State Street works into that. And again, that could be working well with FEMA or not, depends on how that bottom line comes out of FEMA. But this is to renovate 120 State Street that has been ongoing since back in what, twenty ten, two thousand and Yes, August it has. I mean, we have slowly been doing renovations. The last one that was seriously looked at on that was when we did the heat plant, they were looking at an addition on the backside of 01/2020, a boat addition, and that went away. And now this one really finishes it by doing something with getting rid of the steam lines that run through the concrete slab and that are corroding and or the outside walls in an interstices space. And bringing in chilled water instead of multiple little split units throughout the floors one, two and three. And the rest of the floors have window units that get stuck in every year and taken back out in the fall.

[Alice M. Emmons]: I have a question, Joe. Troy?

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah, so Joe, can you just, you know, is 2,500,000.0, so it, you know, I could pretend, I'm reporting this on the floor, I could potentially get a few questions about this. Can you just play this out for me? So we're reclaiming that 2.5 back to the bottom line. What are the possible scenarios here of needing that money back?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Well, we would be looking to do with the funds is start our design process and also bring a construction manager on board towards the end of schematic design phase. So we pretty much know what we wanna do with the building. Our planning is for that is already done. And it's a schematic design of how we're going to really The biggest one is where does a chiller unit go for that? Is it Does it go, as the commissioner has spoken, about potentially combining other buildings off of that chiller to make a one that maybe that's one side of the street or whatever to evaluate that. But that also brings into how to incorporate the construction side of things. And that's why we want to bring a construction manager on for pre construction services. And when we do a construction manager project, we draft a contract for the full dollar amount of the project. That way you're not walking in with, in this case, we could be upwards of $900 to $1,000,000 in pre construction services for that project. And then you're not going to do a $19,000,000 change order. So we do a full dollar amount, doing full well at the end of pre construction, we can pull out similar to our A and E contracts that at the end of each phase, if the project proves not to be viable or needs to be changed at that point in time, we do have out center contracts. So that is why what we're looking to have these funds is to have those funds already incorporated into the project with design and a construction manager.

[Alice M. Emmons]: To add insult to injury, we also cut their bonded amount by a million dollars.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: We

[Alice M. Emmons]: did this at the beginning of section two. We did cut, we did have 2,000,000 in there for FY '27 bonded, and we did cut them by a million. Is that right? Yeah. So in total, there is a $3,500,000 correct, which leaves them what I had, the total project costs that they were anticipating is about 5,200,000.0. We took out at least three, so at least 2,000,000 right now.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Doesn't allow us that if the project goes faster than I anticipate to repurchase the long lead items. Right now, electrical switch gear can be as far out as two years. Chillers are about a year, year and a half out. Can I know that so those are one of those things where, once we're almost done with our preconstruction phase, we're at that point where we'd be going out to bid? Some of these items, we want to order in advance.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And what would be the cost of those two items, the ones that

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: I don't I do not know that estimate.

[Alice M. Emmons]: No. The other thing, you can move money between the projects. And I am assuming that we have clarified this. I am assuming because you can move money between projects in section two. We're very clear you can do that with bonded out. Are we clear you can do that with the cash? Pretty sure you could, but I don't know. Because the line I mean, the law was done when we only dealt with bonded dollars. And I would assume it would carry through with a cash within section two.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: And what's your side sheet?

[Alice M. Emmons]: I don't what a certain means. But, you know, when you do have something has to do there.

[James Gregoire]: Pretty

[Alice M. Emmons]: much. Does that, like, per caps?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Nothing for hedge.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yeah. Something like So you do have the ability to move money at least between the bonded projects within your sense?

[James Gregoire]: Wouldn't that be a straightforward question? Kevin? I mean, there ought to be somebody that can answer that question if it's or nothing.

[Alice M. Emmons]: It would be John.

[James Gregoire]: Right. Right. So it shouldn't be great. We ought to know that answer.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: I don't either. I agree with you.

[James Gregoire]: I'm just saying we ought to get that answer.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Read the statute, and I've had the same question as to whether or not we can. Haven't come up against it really.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right. We're all learning because this is the first time that we've really had this structure. Just making note. Mean, I the language in the statute doesn't limit it to market. It just gives you the ability to move money between projects and such. Correct.

[James Gregoire]: I've got a dumb question, I'm if I seeing this cash in FY '27. So was this moved from previous years or is this new cash? No, these are,

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: all the ones here. When you look at the numbers on the row, let's take one row, 191 BGS 900, 230, 1801 planning, reuse and contingency. Yep. That '23 is the year of the act. So all of these are acts of '23, except for the last one on row 198. That is acts of '24. It's bringing it forward, yes, because it expires at the '23. So

[Alice M. Emmons]: it's in the FY '27 catch call. Yes. We're in the reallocation.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Right. We're bringing it forward.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Now available for our FY 'twenty seven capital budget.

[James Gregoire]: I got it.

[Alice M. Emmons]: It's a new number, and they hit that three year mark. And

[James Gregoire]: can't be an accounting transfer because once we cut a contract, it specifies which account it's coming out. And if it came out of bonded, we can't put cash in there at this point. I mean, obviously, because you would have done that if you could. Instead of using new money

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Right. If it was just a

[James Gregoire]: If it's accounting error, you you could just swap it for instance.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Accounting error. I think it's a way finance department finance management sets up their financial accounts.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Well, there's that and the money expires cash in the end of three years. So that's just this is just the language of bringing it forward to '27 and that clock starts all over again. Whether or not, my guess is we'll get new DEBT IDs. So this number of 09/23 goes away, we get a new number.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So department ID number that is assigned to the Department of Finance and Management. That

[James Gregoire]: is correct.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And BGS is only for the years and the department ID numbers that you will see up at the top here basically in the white where you start reallocating funded hours. They're used to working these numbers, not the money. That's in another world.

[James Gregoire]: Yep, I understand.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So I'll ask John about the legality of moving money between projects, in your section also means you can move money between projects that are funded with in section two. Okay.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Up next would be yes. Row 193, Pittsford, the admin in West Cottage. We've been striving to get this project done. It's sort of the last major renovation of that old sanitarium. We did the East Cottage several years ago. We do have a lot of structural issues in the admin, the main portion of the building. The many renovations that has happened prior, I think, me starting with the state, actually. There are a lot of people who decided to cut some joists, knock out some support walls and the likes of that. So we do have some structural issues that we will be resolving with this. And then the West Cottage also of providing air conditioning, hopefully new windows and energy upgrades in the West Cottage. The West Cottage was done in the late 80s, 90s in that ballpark. Doesn't have air conditioning. So again, we're putting in window units, taking men in and out.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So I know this we we have appropriated money over time for this project. Do you currently have money in the bank for this project outside of the $4.50?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yes. This is it. Yes. So this is it. And I will be going out. We're going the project managers drafting the RFP now in anticipation that this is coming. That the main building in the West Cottage have knob and tube. We've just about maxed out our electrical service on that aspect that even to add like another air conditioner requires us potentially to put a new electrical service in to handle that additional power.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So where are you getting the money to go out for an RFP? This is all the money you have.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Again, this is the whole thing that I have to deal with my project manager around scheduling is that, you know, this request is in there and it's we've been eyeballing this for a number of years. So we're now moving forward with it. So that individual has an opportunity to at least start drafting the RFP. It just will not go out on the street until we have funds for So it's a juggle that I have to do with a lot of our projects as you know.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So that just gives us a heads up that the next budget cycle.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Absolutely. I mean, it's one of those things where, you know, as leadership adjusts, you adjust, everybody at the Senate adjusts and whatnot, how that whole my schedule, my project managers adjust accordingly also.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Got it. So really what happened with this project, that April came up against the three year timeframe?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It did, it did. We were the project manager. One, was short staffed for quite a while. We're now doing pretty good. I'm only down four employees, so that's not bad. But this individual had multiple projects, but she works well with public safety. I know this is not really necessarily public safety, it's a criminal justice training council, but it's very similar. She also sits on the board that they have down there for BGS. So she works well with them and just with everything else she's been working on, hasn't been able to get it out the door. We're now ready. So it's just waiting on the funds to be reallocated.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Okay.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: To run 01/1994, the DCF stabilization facility. Those funds there, as you've heard, we are in talks with a contractor, design build contractor in South Burlington. What we're looking to do here with these funds is to do the design. So it's not rolled into a lease. So we're separating out the design costs from the actual construction and what will be the ultimately the lease. So that's why with these funds and the additional ones that we're requesting is to move forward with that design.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So you're reallocating cash, 372,000. Just trying to follow this because we put in money. We put in think it was over $1,000,000 to to start either purchasing land or design documents for this. Then we went into the design build for, and we pulled money some money from that. So what do you have in the bank right now? Because you're you're in negotiations right now. You went out with a new RFP Yes. To see where where else we could put it because it got pulled out of rejects. Mhmm. So where how much do you have in the bank right now?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: These would be the funds that are in the bank that are being reallocated. So we couldn't.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So the 770 plus thousand that we have in FY twenty seven will backfill some of this loss and allow you to vote for.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Judge Bennington, what's my

[James Gregoire]: that's what I was gonna say.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So what triggered so you don't have any of this $300,000 to go? That

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: is correct. We do not.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Because when the bill was being put together by the 5th Floor

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yeah. We started, what, in September. And at that time, I think the architect was on the street. I I don't hold me to it. I forget when we

[Alice M. Emmons]: Let's see if I can do something.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It may have. I know we were working on it. We had not it had not been out to bid. We had not received proposals back yet. So until we actually have a contract in place, we cannot encumber the funds. So knowing that going forward, we were bringing that forward knowing that we're going to need that. These funds to execute a contract where they're contracted to complete the design.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So what we did for the DCF juvenile facility, the governor put in 07/2500 plus in cash Yes. That would incorporate basically the 352 cash just being wait. $3.72 cash is being reallocated and then an additional 400 tax rate. Yes. Yes. So if Department of Children and Family Services doesn't come through the next few weeks operating budget in terms of their contracted costs for providing services to the youth. You folks have no money With the caption. I don't wanna go down there.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: The money's there. We just can't spend it. I think it's the way that would be. Because this would provide that the money's there, but do that other language.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So we really need to hear from Department of Children and Family Services to our policy committees and our appropriations committee what the plan is for and the costs for them to contract out for services, what entity is gonna provide the services to the youth that will be housed there. We really need that information. There's that issue. Thank you, Joe. You're welcome.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Rule one ninety five, the Superior Courthouse in Barrie, the Washington County Courthouse. Again, bringing funds forward. We were up in the air the last time that we were sort of looking at these, this facility is whether or not it's renovate to what we have, knowing that what we have for square footage is not enough, and whether or not it would be worthwhile to look elsewhere to construct a new building, potentially demo the old building, build on place, or go elsewhere. We've done a land search, and we have not found an appropriate property in the downtown area of the city of Barrie. And so I'm working right now with analyzing the demo versus replace in kind right now as opposed to renovating it, what that works. So once I'm done with that, we'll be looking to go out to bid for design. What will be there? I don't know yet. Have spent some of these funds earlier for a report that does say that X number of square feet would be required onto this building for all the four entities that are in that building to remain. Is that really the thing to do with a tight site and the likes of that?

[Alice M. Emmons]: So do you have any other money bank for this? Because we've been working on this for a number of years. I'm sure there's some bonded dollars that we can put in. Do you know?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Cash. FY '24 cash funds.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So it's not cash?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yes. I think

[Alice M. Emmons]: So you have money from it. This was f y this was '23. So are you

[Troy Headrick]: That was appropriated '23, f y twenty four.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So it's f y twenty four.

[James Gregoire]: '50. Is that

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: No. I'd have to look. I don't have it with me, but it was 850,000. Maybe that was so that it could be x of 24 cash. But, yeah, there were there's other cash that's out there.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So you don't know if they have what if they have money in the bank already. Mhmm. Right.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: And that will does moving forward in our design process of that because the report that was done by French Freeman, HOK, a year plus ago, if the addition is done to incorporate everybody on that site, was upwards of $40,000,000 renovation project. That includes temporary relocation of the courts and people and staff and all of that. So that was a sizable project. If that's not done, then the other entities that we would be looking either for building new and working space for them also. So there's that whole thing that we have to put together as to what we were going to do with that site.

[Alice M. Emmons]: We got two courthouses really in the air right now. Courthouse Of Barrie and the Mid Fort Courthouse. Yes. You're saying if we build new, the very courthouse could be up to 40,000,000.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: If everybody was to stay in that location, yes. And the temporary swing space and all of that. Like, both courthouses are in dire need. So we just lost the generator at the courthouse here, I don't know, five months ago. We're on a temporary bury right now. Yes. We replaced the air handler unit on the roof last year.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And this courthouse is the criminal?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: That is correct. There are state's attorneys in there, probation parole, DCF, and the court themselves.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Just a tour of action here. Yep.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Your building is a bonus. It is, you know, well above the base flood elevation plus two. So by foot, I think. There's no land. But when you look at the potential for the design that when it was constructed in the early eighties, it's on a skew to the main street. And that was to back in the day, where instead of air conditioning, you stroking the windows and allow the air to blow through. And the air handler was also to come on at night to bring in the cooler outside air. People built walls on the outside, offices around the outside walls. So that sort of stops some of that airflow. Plus the air lately has been more humid than dry. So that doesn't necessarily work when you still have a humid night to bring in all that humid air. So back, I say it was in the days of Jim Richardson, we looked at squaring off the front of that building and bringing it to the curb like the rest of Main Street. So that is the potential of doing that also and providing a new entryway and reworking the site.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So the other piece is to relocate Massacolony DCF in P State of China.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yes. I haven't done the math on the square footages. Who has more space? I think if you looked at it, AHS may have a little bit more space right now because of both DCF and probation and parole being on the floors that they're on. But the needs for judiciary because of their higher caseload coming in needs another, they're looking for another criminal courtroom. And so that takes up based on the courtrooms that they have right now about a third of that of a floor. And so if you move that up, they will obviously then become the major square footage need than the other two.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And there's no room in McFarlane?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: That I don't know. If it is, I don't know if they can handle which one they could handle. Well, this

[Alice M. Emmons]: one's not gone away. Neither is the fault. Okay.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: None of my projects go away. They just get kicked on the road. Next up is 19646, the Rutland Field Station. Right now, we're working on that one with the setting that we have to design the Rutland Field Station going from the North End of Rutland further south into Clarendon. We purchased that property while we were working on the design of Westminster. And then the need for both Middlesex to go to Berlin and Williston to be completed became a priority for public safety. And now this one is up next. And so this will continue along that course to get them into new quarters.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So you've already, what we put in and bonded in FY 'twenty six and 'twenty seven for this is 3,600,000 So you do have money to work with. Yes.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: We've just completed schematic design. With that, it looks relatively good on that site. We're going to into design development and we'll also start looking at our permits. We're lucky that there's not a lot of wetlands on there. But we do have a lot of pavement and building square footage, we'll be creating stormwater ponds and indoor gravel wetlands to capture stormwater runoff. Because we will we will be disturbing more than an acre.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yeah. Let's go to the EV charging.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: EV charging. Yes. We have. We were down. Project managers for our energy group. I now have one on board who are starting to actively engage in this. We have there's grant money with ACCD for 500,000, but that has to go to the public use along with state employees. These funds here go to actually, like, to Fleet, and Fleet's not using it, then state employees can use it. So part of this juggling act with the EV charging station is where they're being located. We've had an issue with the Essex facility for mental health that we've provided there's two charging heads back in their parking lot, which was out back of the facility. And what happened is it did make its way out of the public, which has been pulled, and people were coming in and charging. It's just that one thing. You know, when you're charging your vehicle, struggling in a location like that, you got nothing to do but hang around, and that just doesn't look good. Public safety does not like that. But like the Williston facility, the Clarendon facility, Westminster, we have put in the infrastructure for it just in case it does come along that there's a greater need. We do have that. Berlin, we do have one charging head out there and then also one in the secure yard. So we can do them in the secure yard for the employees. So that is where the ACCD funds will not come into play. These funds will come into play.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So the ACCD, Agency of Commerce and Community Development, has about $500,000 for installation of EV charges to be used by the public as well as state employees.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It is.

[Alice M. Emmons]: That's the money that you're going to be using.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yeah, we're going to be starting on that right away. When this comes back through, we'll be starting on the other to where do they Yes. Yes.

[Alice M. Emmons]: State money.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: The

[Alice M. Emmons]: state money for GES going go to our fleet as well as state employees.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It's like over at 136 State Street here in Montpelier, we have charging stations that are similar to that. Fleet Parks their vehicles there, they charge, but if they're out during the day, it is still able to the public to use and or state employees to use. But some of these will go for the state employees use, will go potentially in like with public safety, they have a secure yard and or potentially in some of the correctional facilities that these here are more for state employees and not for the public because of you don't want the public in some cases having to spend an hour or so to charge in that location hanging out at some of these facilities.

[Troy Headrick]: Are these phase one or phase twos?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Phase two. They are.

[James Gregoire]: Yes. Now what about these down here?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: They are phase two as you're coming closer up the hill. Think there's four heads that are phase two. Then you come up. There's And then there's additional post that I think has some phase ones. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So which one is quicker? Phase one or phase three?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Phase three is the fastest, but that's also crazy. It is expensive because of yes. It's very expensive. It's DC charge.

[James Gregoire]: Yep. Yeah. So

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: are are those pay pay for use? Those those phase two heads? Do the users pay for the electricity? Yes. They do. Their language was was allowed years ago to to do that. Yes.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yes. We made sure we did that. Yeah.

[James Gregoire]: It should be.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yeah. And that's the contract you have with the with the

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: people. There's a provider who tracks that and manages it. Good. And again, the last one is 120 State Street that we have discussed. Okay.

[Alice M. Emmons]: This is very helpful. I just wish we had done this a little bit when we were working on the bill and do this even after the fact. It's very helpful. Troy, do you have enough to go on with the Yeah.

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah. Do. Can you just confirm that this is me presenting? I'm doing 18 I mean, I'm doing seventeen, eighteen, and nineteen as well? Yes. Okay. Yeah, I've got enough here if I get questions. I'm gonna keep it pretty high level though.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Totally high level.

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Anything else on this before we take a break and shift gears? Thank you, Joe, for coming in on I short know you're away with some big family, but you come back, and I've got to go back into that committee. Thought I I was doubling. A way

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: to start my week, right? Just come here first and Where was Del Rio, Texas visiting my son.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Nice. He's such it's cold out there.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It was 67 degrees in the morning. Towards the end of the day, six to eight, 09:00 at night is when it got up into the nineties. So it took that long. It was cloudy in the mornings. And you get a little color.

[Troy Headrick]: So where's Del Rio? Like, where is it in Texas?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: It is two and a half hours west of San Antonio. Where he's stationed? Middle of nowhere. Aufland Air Force Base.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Yep.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Unless you water your lawn, it's stone and dirt. Beautiful area.

[James Gregoire]: Checked out

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: the border. Yep. Nice wall. Learned a lot actually on that, that how much where the Rio Grande is, there were homes, road, and in some cases probably up to half a mile until you hit the actual wall. Yeah. It was pretty interesting. It's not just on the border and it's not a straight line. Zigs and zags in it. It is. Border patrols everywhere. Pretty interesting. But, yeah, hey. That's a lot of fun.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Good.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Went to an air they had an air show. Nice. That was good too. So

[James Gregoire]: Good for you. Great.

[Troy Headrick]: Is your family down there?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Or is he just No. He he he's he's in the air force. Yep. And he's stationed right there now to he's flying a t six, which is a high speed two seat prop plane right now. Yep. And soon, he hopes he'll graduate from that, and he's hoping to move to a t six, which is a jet, And that he wants to be a fighter pilot. So that's what he's looking for is to land into that. If you watch the first Top Gun, what were they? They were the Russian planes that when cruise was upside down and whatnot, that plane, it's the same. They didn't have the actual Russian jet. Didn't have 39, they didn't actually make. So that's what they used and just painted it black. This was looking fly. That's cool. And so yeah, he's having a great

[Alice M. Emmons]: time. Exactly. You.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Going back down again in June when he graduate.

[James Gregoire]: For sharing that.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: My son beat in Del Rio, Laughlin Air Force Base, trained to be a fighter pilot. First round's done in June, then he hopefully moves on to a jet for training. Nice.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Well, you, Joe.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Thanks, Ben. You're welcome.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And let's go off of you two. We'll take a break.

[Troy Headrick]: Alice I have a quick question for you. So I just want to clarify you've got me for thirteen fourteen and fifteen.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Let me see. Have give you 416. Who has 15?

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Well, that's my question. You gave me 09:13, fourteen, fifteen, and sixteen.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So, WIL has ANR section nine and clean water section 10. We don't need anything on section 11 or section 12. So we have section 13, which is public safety. Section 14, which is judiciary. Mhmm. And we don't need much for 15. 16.

[James Gregoire]: Mhmm. It's the one you told me I have.

[Alice M. Emmons]: You, I have Troy written here. Okay. You have

[Troy Headrick]: I to get just wanna clarify because I don't think it makes a lot of sense to pass back and forth so quickly here. So if you have me, let's just clarify because I'm assuming you've got me for seventeen, eighteen, and nineteen.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right, and then you go, because they will mean, they're actually gonna go to the sale.

[Troy Headrick]: But I don't, but I, yeah, so if you have me for 13, fourteen, like don't think it makes sense to pass this to somebody for section 16. But I if you don't have me for thirteen and fourteen

[Alice M. Emmons]: You you've got section 16. Correct.

[Troy Headrick]: Okay. I this is what I'm trying to clarify. So yeah. So just tell me where I start and where I finish. I'm assuming that

[James Gregoire]: go you ahead.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Start at section 13 you have 14. 15. And we're not doing 15. There was no change there.

[Troy Headrick]: Yep. 16.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And then 16 is a historical society. Then you go into the reallocations of bonded cash.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yep.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And then I gotta find my bill.

[Troy Headrick]: A a little brief explanation of bonding capa you know, general bond obligation, bond capacity. You know, the bond premium is what I'm

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: trying to say. And then

[Troy Headrick]: what we just did now. But James, you thought you were in there somewhere?

[Alice M. Emmons]: You're not in there, James.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Oh, I only wrote down what I was told, the boss was looking at this when she said it, so I don't know. Oh, I think, yeah, you're talking about different section numbers in the bill. Here, nine, thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen vice.

[Alice M. Emmons]: You go

[James Gregoire]: after Joe doesn't have to stay does he? Unless

[Troy Headrick]: you really want to sit here and

[James Gregoire]: look at

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: that anymore right now. No. So

[Troy Headrick]: I'm doing 13 to the end of the spreadsheet.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right. And then and then it goes to section in the cap in the bill itself.

[James Gregoire]: Mhmm.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Because it changes sections in the bill. The cash fund authorizations start on section nine of the bill, so it's not the spreadsheet. And James has all the rest of the bill to the end. Cash. You add the cash. I thought James repeat.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: I'm doing four, five, and six. Yeah.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So the problem is you got

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: I'll do whatever.

[Alice M. Emmons]: No. I let me let me you're doing Sean is doing because he's doing and this is where it gets confusing. On the spreadsheet. Shawn is doing sections four, five, and six. And part of that is dealing with the store preservation, is also dealing with the bill of page 17, section 12. But you're not doing that because No, no 12 on it. So in the language on the bill, James is doing the cash run on section nine. And then he is going to do because Will is doing section 10 of the language because that pertains to the ANR section of the money in the spreadsheet. So James and Will is doing section ten and eleven, which deals with that drinking water revolving loan fund language. He's gonna do that when he does his money. James will continue on section 13, which is the lease for Forest And Parks, fourteen and fifteen, which is a land transfer for Springfield Correctional Facility, and 16, which deals with the high end facility for the youth and then the committee vote. Joe, when you do section two, where you talk about the pre note in section three, when you talk for the WiFi installation, you've got language on section 17 of the bill itself. I

[James Gregoire]: don't know either.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Joe, did you hear us? Say again, I'm sorry.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So when you do section three for the money for the WiFi, you had language at the very end of the bill. Yes. Section 17

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah. That was noted.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Indicate in your report.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: That that was noted yesterday. Yes. And I noted it as well.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So that prevents all the jumping around.

[James Gregoire]: Mhmm.

[Alice M. Emmons]: So, Troy, you're gonna yield to James. Okay. And

[Troy Headrick]: I don't think I have any I don't have any language references aside from do you want me to reference the language when I talk about DCF? Stabilization? And do you want me to talk about the language where we've, allowed for movement of money at the veterans home?

[Alice M. Emmons]: Is doing the vets home.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: The vets are. I've

[Troy Headrick]: got Veterans Home, and I've got reallocation to the Veterans Home.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Well, Shawn has the Vets Home in the spreadsheet.

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah. I'm I'm sorry. Just I'm just I'm I mentioned it when I do the reallocation. Elevator upgrade. So, line one seventy three.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right. Yeah. Yeah. You should you should probably do that.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: In the in the

[Alice M. Emmons]: Bro, you should do in the real patients, what's highlighted in bright yellow.

[Joseph "Joe" Luneau]: Yep.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And I would just do really, really high level on these allocations because I don't want people to get the weeds of this.

[Troy Headrick]: Right. So, I was just gonna say something to the effect that you're gonna notice that we've reclaimed the elevator upgrade money, but that went right back to the veterans home, and there's language to that in the bill. Right. Something to that out of fact. Similar, when I get to DCF stabilization facility on line one ninety four, do you want me to acknowledge the language that we put in there that that money won't be spent until we get more information from DCF?

[Alice M. Emmons]: Oh, I wouldn't give you that.

[Troy Headrick]: Just Would or would not?

[Alice M. Emmons]: Would not.

[Troy Headrick]: Okay.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Would not. You know what I would say with this cash amount? I would just say that we hit the three year mark. These funds were not encumbered. And due to statute, they get reallocated

[Troy Headrick]: Right.

[Alice M. Emmons]: The current projects.

[Troy Headrick]: And for the most part, we're moving them back to the same project.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right. I keep it to that point.

[Troy Headrick]: Yeah. Okay. And we technically didn't so repo didn't interpret it the same way. We didn't technically hit the three we don't hit the three year mark until July 1.

[Alice M. Emmons]: Right.

[Troy Headrick]: But by the time this is done, we will have not hit the three year mark. But

[Alice M. Emmons]: That's that's in the weeds for us.

[Troy Headrick]: I know. I get it. Yeah.

[Alice M. Emmons]: And this is new to our world that we now have general fund dollars,

[James Gregoire]: but

[Alice M. Emmons]: they have a substantial portion of our capital budget. And we are going to have to work through this reallocation process more and more each year. So this is a learning curve for all of us. So let's go out for YouTube. Let's take a break and come back and we can pick up. We have committee discussion at 09:30. At 11:00, we've got the Montpelier update for flood recovery with John Cochins. I would suggest that people start working on their report. We don't have to be live for that, but I would suggest that people start working on their report. And then we're back on YouTube and back with testimony at 11:00. Okay. Sure. Okay? Great. With John Copans.