SmartTranscript of House Environment-2025-02-12-11:00AM

[Speaker 0 ]: Okay. We are live. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Alright. Welcome to, reconvening our our morning hearing with House Environment Committee and shifting gears to sustainable forestry with the Vermont Forest Products Association and professional logging contractors of the northeast. Welcome. [Colleen Goodridge]: Good morning. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: I'm starting live. I I just Colleen, do you would you like to start? [Colleen Goodridge]: Sure. So for those of you who I don't believe I know everyone on your committee, but I do believe that Larry Labor, is he in the room? Yes. And Ellech Chapin, is she in the room? I can see her. Yeah. So I I do know a couple of you, not all of you, unless we've seen each other in passing as we've been at the card room occasionally. But for those of you that don't know me, I own Goodridge Lumber up in Albany, Vermont with my three sons. We have just celebrated fifty years in the business, growing that business from the ground up. Actually, I think we were underground to start with, but we specialize in white cedar, which is a local natural resource. And we have seven employees and we work with probably seventy different logging suppliers throughout the year with our raw material being secured within seventy five miles of the mill here. So I'm old enough now to say that I've actually been seeing my third generation of folks working in in this business of the working land. So that dates me. So figure out fifty years plus when I started at age one. I'm only fifty one. I'm also vice president of the Vermont Forest Products Association, which is a organization that has been representing all sectors of the industry from landowners, loggers, truckers, logging contractors, sawmills, secondary processors, biomass, firewood processors, all of us that it takes to get the wood harvested from the forest to the customer as a finished product. And we've been doing that since nineteen seventy seven. We advocate for a strong forest products industry because we we know the importance of it. We also do education in our membership for safety, logger training, business training, anything that can help our members do the best job that they can do. And we also, education outside of the industry, we work a lot with schools from kindergarten up, work with the tech centers, and the general public, which may not always understand what we do or why we do it. And as we're up in rural Vermont. Most everyone that's been brought up on a farm knows the life cycle of a tree and new growth, and the cycle goes on and on. But, sometimes people may not have had that opportunity as we move away from, more rural settings to more urban settings. So, we need to tell our story. It's a good story, and, those of us that are in the woods working or in the mill need to do a little bit better job of providing that information to folks. I've often been asked over fifty years in the business what is a significant event or something important. And I would say I'd go back to two thousand eight, two thousand nine when the Vermont Council of Rural Development did their detailed survey on what the core values of Vermonters were. And out of that came the farm and forest. The working lands were the core values. That's something that we all share. We all can agree on. And I will say it put forestry up, on the same level as agriculture. Forestry and agriculture are the same. They're the backbones of of Vermont and our foundation, and it was good to get that recognition. So the topic today was sustainable forestry. So, look up in the dictionary. What what does that mean? Well, managing forests to ensure they are healthy and productive for future generations. So that that's what we're all about. And we know that through sustainable forestry, the core values that we all have will be sustained. Without sustainable forestry, it's gonna be a questionable whether we can sustain all the core values and all the benefits that we experience. What we have today did not happen by accident, but, you know, generations of families that dedicated their lives to working the land. So forest, we know are all important to us. We use forest products daily in our lives. And, okay, what is the forest products industry? Well, it's composed of practitioners that go out and do the work. They weed the garden and they do the work on the land. And without these practitioners, we can't have sustainable forestry or the benefits from that. Our industry is so important for in many ways. One is, as I just mentioned, it is part of our culture and our traditions in Vermont. Another is the economic driver. I mean, it's it provides income for many. I think you're gonna have probably Danny Fitsco or, Catherine Savito in, and they can give you all the breakdown of statistics of dollars and cents and sectors and so forth. But for today, we know that it is of economic importance to the state. And thirdly, all the environmental benefits that we get from the industry, clean air, clean water, timber products, wildlife habitat, recreation, and, yes, even helps with climate change. So all of those things are are important. And I like to look at both. I like to celebrate if I can. And we do have a lot to celebrate in our state. We're seventy six percent forested, eighty percent private landowners. We celebrate the working lands enterprise initiative, what which was a offshoot of the Vermont, Council of Rural Development survey knowing our core values. I can tell you that this last year, our sawmill, which always got its three phase power from generators through working lands grant was able to transfer to power off the grid to get three phase power, which is going to, save emissions. Thirteen thousand gallons of diesel fuel, we won't need. So we and I know that Tucker Riggs, laughing stock farm forest products received a grant to expand his sawmill. So we're thankful for those programs. Vermont farm and forest viability program, so important to help farms and and forestry workers do business planning. Yes. We don't just saw. We we do have to plan businesses even even more today than ever. Succession planning. We've got the forest future strategic road map process. Very, very detailed much collaboration that is being rolled out. We have potential for new products besides the products that we already have, biomass, biochar, cross laminated timbers, insulation. I mean, there's a lot of research and development going on about how can we use these resources, for different products thinking out of the box. Something using a local product that's renewable and natural. So we live in an area where we have regeneration. If we have our management plans correctly, we can sustain we can sustain our all of our benefits. Now that's so the challenges that we we see, one of them is mother nature. And I think that affects all of us. But, we've had to we can't tell her what to do. We will say that she is providing us with a cold winter this year, and I think at least all the mills are getting plenty of wood. So I I will say that's a plus. After two years of ground not freezing and two summers of floods, it's been very hard for anyone to stay viable in the last two years. But we are looking better as far as, this winter is concerned. Workforce is another challenge. A few years back, it was fifty five years of age was the average. I bet it's sixty now. People are aging out. We're not seeing the new generation coming in. First off, we some of the long time people that have had generations working in the woods. You know what? This is so this is pretty tight. I don't know if you are gonna be viable, and maybe you better go find something else to do. That's that's where we are in a lot of places. I think the other thing is we need to do a better job in our recruitment of young people talking about career exploration. We've lost tradespeople, people to sharpen your saws, people to file your band saw blades. Lots of our technical service people are aging out as well, and that leaves us with, well, what do we do now? We have lost sawmills and other forestry related businesses with not I don't know, very few new businesses come coming into the state. You know, why is that? Are there ways that we can incentivize companies to come to Vermont? Does that two fifty play a role in that? I don't know. But, we have the wood here. We can have a workforce if we if we do things correctly, and it is renewable. And now all leads to healthy forests and all the benefits that we, get. The other thing is public perception. We have not done a good job about telling what we do, why we do, and the importance of it. So, I we're coming out of the woods and coming out of the mills, and we're trying to do a better job of letting people know what we do, why we do it. And maybe some of you saw the documentary, Seeing the Forest for the Trees. I would urge you to take a look at that if you haven't. That that's really a very good documentary. It's about thirty five minutes long, but, it's talking about science and fact and benefits. And that we need to pay attention to. A lot of people are getting misinformation or have misperceptions. So along with all the other challenges, we we need to be proud of what we do, and we know that if we do it correctly, it will continue for generations. So those are some of the positives I see, some of the challenges for us in the industry. And we will be I should mention too, you may meet, Gwen Zakoff who is our new our lobbyist. So just to mention that, we did have a change. She's with us now, and you may have met her or will meet her. She keeps track of things that are going on down at the state house. God bless you. I read what your mission was of all the different areas that you're trying to balance out, and I'd have a headache if I was down there. I'll tell you. So we're all trying to balance everything out. We are taking a look at the tier three study and act two fifty impact what the implications for working forest and sustainable forest management. What will that mean? Climate change initiatives. We wanna make sure that it's recognized forest critical role in the sequestration and renewable energy production. So we're we're watching the climate change initiatives. Conservation goals, balancing the thirty by thirty and fifty by fifty, with practical land use management. So, I know there's a bill now to include use value appraisal land in the the inventory of of conservation inventory. So I think that would be a plus. So hopefully that that will that will be passed. Global warming solution act, we wanna make sure those are gonna remain managed, long term health and economic viability. Just leaving things alone is you know, there may be we we can all manage for different areas and different purposes. But to get things out of balance by doing nothing, we will be excuse me. Diseases, rain, hurricane going fires, windstorms, all kinds [Speaker 0 ]: of things. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: I'm gonna interrupt I need to interrupt you for one second. Maybe try turning off your video. All of a sudden, the sound is is we're losing you, and I I think yeah. Let's see if that helps. [Colleen Goodridge]: Is that better? [Chair Amy Sheldon]: So far. [Colleen Goodridge]: Okay. And then, of course, we're concerned about the declining infrastructure, our mills, and so forth. So we have a lot of challenges ahead of us, but I think if we work together, we will come out with the best solutions and help shape a future that can accommodate all of our values. [Dana Doran]: Right. [Colleen Goodridge]: That's all I have to say. Questions. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Alright. Thank you. Thank you for your testimony. Do members have questions? Representative Austin. [Colleen Goodridge]: Just where would we be able to see that film or access that film, seeing the forest from the trees? [Representative Mike Tagliavia]: I can [Colleen Goodridge]: I can tell you I can it's on our it's v our website v t f p a dot org? Okay. You can click on it there, and then there's some smaller episodes. But, there it's very, very well done. And, it's probably the best voice we've ever had as far as providing information. So thank you. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Yep. Representative Chapin. [Speaker 0 ]: Hi, Colleen. It's it's Ella Chapin. Great to see you. I just wanted to you just maybe take a moment to speak a little bit about how much product your business puts out and where it goes, like, what kind of customers you have. And if your mill didn't exist, where and and many of our bills didn't exist, where where would they be getting that product? Could you just speak a little bit to to where the the lumber goes that you've produced? [Colleen Goodridge]: Yeah. So our mill annually saws about a million board feet of product. We're we're just a medium sized mill. We we provide the market for seventy different loggers, truckers, landowners on a yearly basis. Our product, probably sixty percent of the product is wholesale, being fence companies, a playground company, a raised garden bed company. Now those are through New England. Most of our retail is local throughout Vermont. And I would say if we weren't here, I don't know I don't know there would be, what the market would be for for the cedar. There's a few other mills that do a a small amount of board footage per year. Then you get if they have to truck it very far, the transportation costs are are, not are expensive. So if they could find a market, it may not be viable for what they're paying for the product versus the transport. People as far as getting white cedar lumber products, there's a couple other small mills that do a small amount. So it may not be available. [Speaker 0 ]: And do you see do you see some of your customers moving towards more fossil fuel based composite kind of products to replace to replace wood products? [Colleen Goodridge]: I I think they would prefer wood if they could find it. If not, then you go to step two, like, for your decking. You know, they like white cedar decking, but if they can't get it, then probably you'll go to the composite. [Speaker 0 ]: Thanks. Thanks for what you do and all your leadership in the sector. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Representative Taglia. [Representative Mike Tagliavia]: I think I heard you mentioned, sawmills and sawmills up going out of business. What could we in the legislature be doing to encourage sawmills in the state rather than having to, in some cases ship our timber logs to Canada, for instance, and only reimport it as finished lumber? [Colleen Goodridge]: I think one of the the biggest hurdles that I have heard is getting through the act two fifty process. Whether it's expense, regulatory burdens that they can't meet or whether it's time frames. You know? How long does it take to once you submit your your permit to going all through the steps to when you can actually start? So if there's anything we can do to simplify or speed up the permitting process, I think I think that would be a good start. And I don't know if there are ways that we can attract or incentivize companies to look at Vermont. I mean, certainly, they're near the wood source. So that says to me that's a plus if you're not transporting it three hundred miles away. But what I've heard is the permitting is probably the biggest hurdle. I know I think part of an act two fifty bill last year might have been, for smaller size sawmills, the permit requirements were less. I think it it it went with levels. I don't think that passed. But my question is why why can't we yeah. I I think you have a good question there. What can we do to incentivize mills to come into Vermont properly placed with basic rules and regulations and not let them escape over to New Hampshire. [Representative Mike Tagliavia]: Thank you. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Alright. Thank you again for your testimony. We will now welcome Dana Doran. [Dana Doran]: Good morning. Everybody hear me okay? [Chair Amy Sheldon]: We can. [Dana Doran]: Excellent. Well, representative Sheldon, representative labor, member of the House Committee on Environment, my name is Dana Duran. I'm the executive director of the Professional Logging Contractors of the Northeast. Pleasure to appear before you today. I wish I could be there in person. Yesterday, I was there, but other commitments precluded me from being there today, so we'll do the next best thing through technology. So just some background on our organization. PLC is a nonprofit educational organization that was created in nineteen ninety five to represent logging and associated trucking contractors throughout the state of Maine in May of twenty twenty three. Our membership voted to expand its president and began representing contractors in in the region, including the state of Vermont. The PLC has three board members from Vermont, Sam Lincoln from Lincoln Farm Timber Harvesting and Randall Center, Jack Bell from Longview Longview Forest in Heartland, and Gabe Russo with Southwind Forestry in Pollitt. And we currently have about twenty five contractor members and ten associate members from the state of Vermont. As an organization, we not only do we exist to educate and advocate for sustainable forestry, we also have invested in verification efforts to ensure that their mission that the mission is also put into practice, and I'll get to that in just a moment. We also, in addition to advocacy, we do safety training and other leadership training for our members and their employees. We have an insurance program. We run a philanthropic program called Log A Load for Kids that raises money for the children's head hospital at UVM in Burlington and a multitude of of other member benefits for our members. So back to certification, we oversee two third party forest management and timber harvesting certification programs. In the year two thousand, our organization created the master logger certification program, which is the world's first and its only third party certification program, which verifies sustainable and responsible logging company practices in the woods. Today, the program is recognized in twenty states in the United States, including in Vermont, as well as three foreign countries, including, Colombia and South America, Estonia in Europe, and in Japan. Currently, there are fifteen master logger certified companies in the state of Vermont, and that number is growing. We have one that's going to be potentially certified in about a week. Additionally, our organization offers and manages a group forest certification program for the Forest Stewardship Council FSC, the world's gold standard for forest certification. Gonyea Lumber from Pittsford, Vermont holds an FSC forest management certificate from our organization for about a thousand acres of timberlands they own as well as an FSC chain of custody certificate for their sawmill. FSC is very important for landowners and mills to be able to distribute their forest products throughout the value chain, and especially for products that get sold, to the global marketplace. It provides a a level of credibility, but it also provides, that credibility to the to the purchaser of those products if they know how their products were, produced and where they came from. So as this committee knows, timber harvesting and hauling are distinct and impactful, components of Vermont's rural economy. So occupations from the industry are inextricably linked to the health and long term management of Vermont's forests, which cover about seventy five percent of the state. The state's reliance on healthy forests for so many attributes, which include economic, recreation, heating, utilization of forest products by every citizen in the state of Vermont requires focus and engagement on policy and programs that support a strong and vibrant forest economy. And just some brief facts. So, obviously, I mentioned the forest land in Vermont as of twenty seventeen data. It was the economic impact is about two point one billion to the Vermont economy. Ninety one million of direct economic impact from logging and trucking. Labor income is about fifty million of that. And then direct logging and trucking jobs, there's about seventeen hundred direct jobs that come from logging and trucking. So, obviously, logging logging and trucking is part of that global or Vermont forest economy that Colleen alluded to, but it doesn't happen without a logger and trucker to produce the wood and bring it to a marketplace. As all of you know, this winter is is certainly probably an anomaly. Although it's great operating conditions, the the markets are a challenge. I'll get back to those in a moment. We've also had three consecutive years of very rainy conditions in in with flooding and exceptional rain events and also two consecutive warm winters. So it has been a significant challenge. With respect to markets, twenty twenty four certainly had an impact upon markets directly in Vermont. We saw the closure of three, markets in Vermont, Putney pay paper and Putney, a Johnson in Bristol, and the Pine Mill, which is called Mill River in Clarendon. Those closures are additive to the low grade market struggles that we've seen throughout the region, especially in Maine over the last fifteen years. We do expect markets in the northeast to recover, but it's going to be a couple of years until we see major changes in interest rates and investment to take place. So despite this gloom and doom, there is hope on the horizon and cyclical markets will return but only if the state continues to manage its forests and ensure that the fabric of the rural economy which includes timber harvesting is kept intact. Keep forests as forests. The value proposition for landowners must remain to own and invest in forest land and for contractors to continue to manage the forests of Vermont to mitigate the impacts of climate change, invasive species, and fire. This will also ensure the forests are healthy to maximize carbon storage in a younger growing stock for the long run. Not to dive too deeply into forest management, but forests are simply gardens with a much longer growth rotation. Early successional forests for instance compete for sunlight and water And the only way to ensure that forests are healthy or they can store carbon, photosynthesize carbon dioxide, they must be managed to eliminate competition. The competition in forests, if not managed correctly, will ultimately determine how they are impacted by the forces around them. Using the vegetable garden analogy for all of you who who plant, vegetables each year. If you plant vegetables in the spring, whether it's carrots, beans, peas, etcetera, inevitably that garden needs to be thinned to ensure the plants do not compete with one another because they will inevitably kill one another off. A forest is essentially a big vegetable garden with a much longer growth rotation. In any forest similar to a vegetable garden, sixty percent of the stocking is low grade and forty percent is material for high value products. Whether it's wood or carrots, competition separates the low from high value. To ensure the forest continues to produce high value wood products that store carbon for the long run, a low grade wood must be removed. In order to remove the low grade wood for the higher grade growing stock to flourish, it requires markets to utilize the fiber that is removed. These markets include paper, paperboard, insulation, textiles, chemicals, and energy. Without these markets, good forestry cannot be conducted to manage sunlight, water, and competition. If this is not done, a forest will essentially outcompete itself and die producing methane, which is more harmful than any other greenhouse gas created by the utilization of wood. Over the past four years, I've been a member of the governor's forest carbon task force in the state of Maine appointed by governor Janet Mills. For your reference, I've attached the two reports that this group has published as a result of our work since twenty twenty. I'm not going to dig too deeply and we'll let you review those reports at your leisure, but I thought it was important to highlight two points that were recognized by this diverse group of stakeholders, which included loggers, landowners, environmental organizations, and other nonprofits. The first is that we we and I think that both of these recommendations are applicable in Vermont. The first is that we recognized keep forests as forests to ensure forest carbon is protected and maximized. There must be markets for low grade wood. Secondly, carbon in trees is maximized in the first ten to eighty years of a tree's life cycle. The carbon sequestration rate is heavily impacted by competition. Thus, the emphasis on removing low grade wood. Additionally, the carbon sequestration rate begins to decline as the tree gets older and inevitably, if the tree is not turned into a solid wood product, it will die in off gas methane providing no carbon storage. Thus, the work of this group was grounded in these two philosophies and the recommendations were made by consensus to keep forests as forests for the long run. Before completing my testimony, I'd also like to highlight some of the recent work by the state of Vermont that has been done to support good sustainable forestry and ensure that forests can be protected for the benefit of all in the long run. Next week, you're gonna hear from the Department of Forest, Parks, and Rec and the Roadmap Implementation Committee. I am a member of that committee as are two of our members, and our work is guided by the principles that I described previously. There's a tremendous amount of positivity with respect to the forests of the state, but much more must be done. Secondly, it's important to note that Vermont does not possess significant markets for low grade products. Vermont pellet, Burlington Electric, and the district heat, Montpelier, facility, which is only two blocks away from where you're sitting right now, and in fact, it provides all of the heat for the state complex, are exceptionally important, to the forest and to logging contractors and the landowners in the state of Vermont. Vermont is also a big proponent of using wood for heat. Thirty percent of all school buildings in the state use some form of wood heat. However, more can be done in this area and I would encourage all of you to champion the use of wood for heat moving forward. Third, the state has also recognized the impact that forestry has in water quality. In the twenty twenty four general assembly, a new program was created to provide funds to logging contractors to ensure water quality is protected. That program is scheduled to go into effect later this year and will be a huge benefit to contractors and to landowners so that harvesting jobs are implemented correctly with correct acceptable management practices and water quality protection regardless of the weather. FBR has also been awarded five hundred thousand dollars by the US Forest Service to stand up a new wooden mat and bridge program for logging contractors to assist with impacts to stream crossing crossings and harvest sites. And lastly, the proposed clean water budget, which will find its way before the general assembly this session, has a recommendation to create a new low interest loan program for logging contractors to purchase low impact equipment that will protect water quality in the state. In closing, I'd like to emphasize that the forests that Vermonters utilize for so many different purposes are here today because of forest management and markets. As a result of those markets, there's more wood growing in Vermont today than there was a hundred years ago. To keep this cycle going and keep forests for all forever, we need to ensure that landowners can afford to retain forests and the value proposition continues. Without it, the economic pressures will inevitably lead to choices regarding the highest and best use, which may lead to less forest land in the long run. Again, appreciate the opportunity to to be here today, and I'm happy to answer any questions. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Thank you for your testimony. Do members have questions? Representative North. [Representative Rob North]: Yes. Thank you, Dana, for your presentation. Two questions. One, how does forest management good forest management as you're proposing affect biodiversity? [Dana Doran]: It hasn't yeah. Very good question, representative North. So, you know, it's it's been proven that habitat that could be birds, that can be wildlife thrive as as a result of forest management. So we have songbirds that seek habitat where they have enough protective cover for different diverse tree species. So when you manage a forest, you may some landowners wanna have you manage for songbirds or different types of bird habitat. We've seen, especially in in the state of Maine, over the last twenty years as a result of different types of harvesting, we've seen the Canadian lynx return to the forest because of the availability of snowshoe hare. So, you know, different types of forest management actually provides greater opportunity for wildlife diversity and habitat as a result. And so it it's good for the entire ecosystem. [Representative Chris Pritchard]: K. And a second follow on question. It is it your understanding that forest land in Vermont is increasing or decreasing in acreage? [Dana Doran]: Good question. You know, I would say for about the last eighty to ninety years, it was increasing. I would say there's significant pressure right now to potentially decrease that because of again, it's that it's a value proposition for landowners in the highest and best use. A landowner has to has always had the ability, for the last hundred years because of the availability of markets to essentially cut wood, have every part of a tree end up going to a marketplace and and getting that value back in in return for owning the property. So they could pay their property taxes, they could make investments on their land, they could keep that property. Over time, there's significant pressure, and we've lost some significant markets in the northeast for you you know, you heard, or the question was asked of of Colleen, you know, about white cedar. And I just mentioned to you what's happened to hardwood markets in Vermont or to or to Putney paper or to pine markets. You know, the market challenges are significant. And, yes, we we see some really positive things on the horizon. You've got Timber HP in Maine in Madison, which is making wood ins or excuse me, insulation for homes and businesses out of wood fiber. We have some biofuel companies that are potentially gonna construct new facilities. Those are on the horizon, but they're still several years away. So, you know, back to your question, representative DeNorth, I think that we're at a a a critical moment with respect to management of the forest in Vermont. If if the value proposition for the landowner can't continue, they're gonna look at highest and best use, and that might be development. That could be renewable energy projects, and it could take that that land out of forest production forever. And so that that's a that's critical as we look to mitigating the impacts of climate change. So what sequestering carbon, doing all those various things and keeping the the economic benefits for all. Thank you. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Representative Tanggadilla? [Representative Mike Tagliavia]: Just say, hypothetical, this this session, the legislature gets it right, and we spark an economic boom in the state where we have housing. And it's affordable. How quickly can the wood products industry spool up at this point right now to be able to have the homes that we're building made from Vermont products? [Dana Doran]: Excellent question. I think the the forest products industry in the northeast could immediately react. What I don't think you have in Vermont is you don't have markets for certain products that are gonna be used in in house construction. You don't have a spruce fir dimensional stud mill. You know, that doesn't exist. That wood will have to come from New Hampshire. It could come from Milan Lumber. It could come from spruce fir mills in Maine. You know, it could come from Canada, but Vermont doesn't doesn't currently have that infrastructure. Pine, you know, there's some small markets, but you lost a significant market in the last year. Most of that wood is gonna come from outside the state of Vermont. You know, insulation is gonna come from outside the state of Vermont. So I think to your question, yes, there's plenty of of wood product that could that can be utilized in in home construction in Vermont to respond to that housing situation. But a lot of those products aren't gonna come from Vermont, and that had that that has pros and cons. I mean, it's good for the other states, and it's good for the management of the forest. But there is a a carbon offset as a result of trucking all those forest products from outside the state of Vermont. I mean, you know, I think for any forested economy, if you can produce a hundred percent of the products that are used in that state, I think everybody's better off. So it it from a manufacturing standpoint, it's gonna take a while to to be able for Vermont to self sustain and create the products that it needs to respond to that that housing situation. [Colleen Goodridge]: Representative Moss, how do you coexist with the maple industry? [Dana Doran]: That's probably a question probably better served to to miss Goodrich just because she represents the landowner. We don't represent landowners in our organization. We work obviously work with them on a daily basis. But the maple industry is vital. I mean, again, you know, I'll just I'll say this, and I think that's probably a question better suited for Colleen. You know, the maple industry in Vermont certainly could be put at risk, whether it's because of of changing climate and weather patterns or that is to that that proposition of of highest and best use for forest land. So we look at bird's eye maple or sugar maple and we we see a product that could be certainly made into a solid wood product, but it also has great value to create maple syrup. So I think it's it's a it's a question for the long run whether folks can continue to make maple syrup or they need to to sell that wood in order to to maintain their forest land. [Colleen Goodridge]: Thank you. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Colleen, would you like to comment? [Colleen Goodridge]: Yes. I would agree with Dana. There are many different uses for forest land. Maple is a big and and getting bigger as far as production is concerned, but it is a forest product. And if forest land is decreasing, that will decrease available maples to be tapped. So it's it's the same kind of the same thing. We're we're using a resource, whether it's in a sawn wood product or whether it's for production of maple syrup. It's forest land. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Representative Ted, we have you? [Representative Mike Tagliavia]: This question is for either of you. Isn't it true, though, that land that's in Sugarbush is also maintained and there can be firewood products harvested while not destroying Sugarbush? [Dana Doran]: Yeah. I'll take that and then let Colleen finish. Know, any sugar bush is gonna continue to grow forest products. It's not you know, there are going to be other species that grow and there's going to be other wood that's grown and, you know, you're gonna have a life cycle of a tree. A tree is not gonna live for for three, four, five hundred years. It's just not. That tree inevitably will die. So there are going to be there's gonna be continuous management that has to take place, whether it's to continue to grow a sugar bush and and maintain a healthy sugar bush or, you know, you're gonna turn it into something else. That that that forest land has to be managed in order to provide that that level of access and, again, sunlight management to keep healthy maple trees. [Representative Chris Pritchard]: Representative Pritchard. I don't know who this question is for, but I guess it's regarding current use in the timber practices, you know, that the landowners utilize there. Have you seen a difference in the quality of the forest through the current use program? [Dana Doran]: I mean, my my response to that would be say would would be to say yes. I mean, the current use program requires a forest management plan. It involve it it requires the the utilization of a consulting forester. It involves the the county foresters to play a role in reviewing those those management plans. And so that cultivation of of a long term forest management ethos is critical to the quality of the forest. Does does everybody follow those management plans? No. I mean, that's a whole other conversation. And are they getting the benefits? Yes. Are they doing what they're supposed to be doing? Again, that's probably a minor subset, but I would say overall, absolutely. It is promoted or provided a benefit to landowners to keep their forests as forests and to do better forest management. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: Thank you both for joining us today. It's really, great testimony. [Dana Doran]: Thank you. Alright. Thank you for having us. [Chair Amy Sheldon]: We will, take a break for lunch and come back at one fifteen.

Play Clip Play Full Video Pause

SmartTranscript of House Environment-2025-02-12-11:00AM

This is useful for seeing what happened at the meeting without wading through the whole transcript: